no ps3 rpg games comeing out?

[Deathknightleo]

i see alot of atlus ps2, 360 and Ds games why no ps3 games as of late nether is a few other companys. like why no rpg's for the ps3 when the ps2 had the most on it. i just don't understand this. i have all the systems that not my problem but considering the ps3 graphics you would think they would jump at the chance to use them for a top of the line rpg. none comeing until 2009 it looking like as of now. any of yea want a ps3 rpg to come out by atlus? or just stick with the 360 for now. oh yea the wii games also... and ds. need something bigger.

[Zephyr]

Well, personally I don't care one way or the other because neither I nor anyone I know owns a PlayStation 3. With Atlus now doing games for XBox 360, maybe they want to stick with what more potential customers actually have. I don't have any numbers to back this up, so it's an uninformed guess, but it seems that a most of us RPG'ers own PlayStation 2's but haven't bothered to pick up a PlayStation 3 yet either because of cost and/or availability of worthwhile games. Maybe in the future that will change.

At least, that's the case with me and every person I know on a personal basis.

[LiquidPhire]

ps3 = lots of dev money / time

lots of money / time = big financial risk

risk takers != japanese developers

japanese developer = atlus

atlus = no ps3 games currently

[Zachalmighty]

ps3 = lots of dev money / time

lots of money / time = big financial risk

risk takers != japanese developers

japanese developer = atlus

atlus = no ps3 games currentlyMath is great.

[Deathknightleo]

yea i been reading most companys have been makeing 360 rpg's as of late. so i just been hopeing for a real next gen rpg to hit the ps3. but yea the ps3 costs alot and i heard was hard to make for also.

[LiquidPhire]

i think microsoft is also throwing a lot of support into the Japanese RPG market because they are still trying desperately to get japanese to buy xboxs (360 still sell at a pitiful rate of around 2000 a week in japan), so thats probably why japanese they are courting microsoft on that front. not to mention its easier to dev for. i think the japanese developers are looking to recoup on the worldwide front, because they certainly wont in japan.

when it comes to Sony though, why make it on the ps3 when you can make it on the ps2? at least for the the smaller publishers and developers, it makes more sense.

when making RPGs for the ps3 becomes more profitable / easier than it is for the ps2, then you will see a quick migration, but until the ps2 is dead dead and dead, i think smaller japanese devs will be hesitant to make that jump.

IMHO of course.

[punk rebel ecks]

Personally no. I like the artstylle of Atlus's games and I think putting up the graphics would ruin them (I.E. Conker's Bad Fur Day). Also as someone said Atlus is a risk taking company and the PS3 just isn't viable for that (as of now at least). I'd personally prefer they'd take towards the Wii.

[massaker]

We'll have to agree to disagree, sir. Conker ruled with better graphics.

I'm only concerned with MGS4.

[tross]

Meh, the ps3 will get some Atlus rpgs at some point, so I don't really care. My ps2 gets more action than my ps3 these days, but that will all change eventually.

[Zephyr]

Personally no. I like the artstylle of Atlus's games and I think putting up the graphics would ruin them (I.E. Conker's Bad Fur Day). Also as someone said Atlus is a risk taking company and the PS3 just isn't viable for that (as of now at least). I'd personally prefer they'd take towards the Wii.

Well, bringing games to PS3 or 360 doesn't necessarily mean that the graphics have to be big and bad. While it does seem that owners of those consoles would prefer higher-end graphics, many gamers like cell shading style, or hand-drawn images, for example. That may be another reason for the continued releases of games on PS2, simply because a more powerful system is unnecessary for some styles of games.

But I do agree with you. I'd rather see more Atlus games for Wii and DS, especially since Wii is in need of more RPG titles.

[SlaughterX]

I don't get the point of this poll...

[thinkfreemind]

It seems to me that Atlus and other RPG makers would be just fine making their games for the 360 instead of the PS3. Many Japanese RPG fans have already purchased a 360 to play games like Blue Dragon, Lost Odyssey, Eternal Sonata, etc.. and I have no doubt that this trend will continue when they see that the 360 is getting other games they want to play.

As for us in America, it is not a secret that the 360 is pretty far ahead of the PS3 in terms of console sales. The bigger the audience they can get here in the States, the better chance their RPGs (not the most popular genre in this country) have to sell. The days of the Playstation brand being the go-to console for games from Japan should be over already.

[Sayckeone]

Well, bringing games to PS3 or 360 doesn't necessarily mean that the graphics have to be big and bad. While it does seem that owners of those consoles would prefer higher-end graphics, many gamers like cell shading style, or hand-drawn images, for example. That may be another reason for the continued releases of games on PS2, simply because a more powerful system is unnecessary for some styles of games.

But I do agree with you. I'd rather see more Atlus games for Wii and DS, especially since Wii is in need of more RPG titles.
You say that as if cel shading and hand drawn graphics couldn't possibly be high end.

Many Japanese RPG fans have already purchased a 360 to play games like Blue Dragon, Lost Odyssey, Eternal Sonata, etc.. and I have no doubt that this trend will continue when they see that the 360 is getting other games they want to play.
What? No. The PS3 is selling much better than the 360 in Japan. Hell, it's even slowly beginning to outsell the 360 here, though I suspect that's only because so many people already have the 360.

[Zephyr]

You say that as if cel shading and hand drawn graphics couldn't possibly be high end.


Yes. Yes I am. The quality of cel-shading can be high, and it can make use of processing power, but by the very nature of the style realism and depth of the visual experience is sacrificed. Unfortunately those are some of the criteria for "high-end graphics" as it is defined by a lot of gamers.

Hand drawn is a no brainer. It's flat. That could be done on much less powerful systems than the PS3, so why charge gamers the price for the power if it's not being used? Yet again, it can be beautiful, but it doesn't take a powerful system to run it.

Basically I'm saying that I want to see more cel-shading and hand-drawn graphics on Wii and the handhelds, and polygons can live on PS3 and 360. The reason? Cost effectiveness. But if PS3 owners make a demand for it, it can of course still be done, and probably will be.

[Voodoo]

I'll take High end Cel-shaded and hand drawn over Photo Realism anyday. I find Hand drawn graphics much more appealing when done properly then any other form.

[Zephyr]

I'll take High end Cel-shaded and hand drawn over Photo Realism anyday. I find Hand drawn graphics much more appealing when done properly then any other form.

Same here. Polygons just don't feel right to me. While they're great in a some types of games, like first person shooters, I prefer alternative methods (cel-shading, drawn, or even sprite) images in my RPG's.

[Kakizaki]

Yes. Yes I am. The quality of cel-shading can be high, and it can make use of processing power, but by the very nature of the style realism and depth of the visual experience is sacrificed


LOL. You realize that this is the same argument that many individuals used to support FMV back in the day -- They thought the photo-realsim provided by FMV would be a more viable form of graphics for those who tired of unrealistic sprites.

Photo realism means nothing. It is every bit as difficult to model a character that stays true to the artists original form/intention. Why haven't we yet seen an accurate modeling of Amano's characters?

Cell shading is still high end -- as is detailed sprite work.

edit - You realize cel shading is still polygons right?

[Zephyr]

Yes. Yes I am. The quality of cel-shading can be high, and it can make use of processing power, but by the very nature of the style realism and depth of the visual experience is sacrificed


LOL. You realize that this is the same argument that many individuals used to support FMV back in the day -- They thought the photo-realsim provided by FMV would be a more viable form of graphics for those who tired of unrealistic sprites.

Photo realism means nothing. It is every bit as difficult to model a character that stays true to the artists original form/intention. Why haven't we yet seen an accurate modeling of Amano's characters?

Cell shading is still high end -- as is detailed sprite work.

edit - You realize cel shading is still polygons right?

Yeah, cel-shading is a type of polygon, though it's not the "pure" form. I was referring to pure computer graphics style.

Maybe by calling cel-shading not "high end" was a bad way to phrase it on my end, but it's just a matter of definition. I'm aware that plenty of work is put into these styles as well, but the fact holds true that many gamers today dismiss them entirely because of their definition of "high end" graphics. What I was saying was that "high quality" and "high end" are two completely separate and unrelated elements of graphics.

Maybe I'm not as technologically savvy as some others around here, but it seems to me that a purely computer graphic-type polygonal game these days is more system intensive than the typical cel-shaded or hand drawn game. CG is usually more "realistic" (depth-wise, not just surface appearance) than the other forms.

But that's from my perspective of a pretty casual gamer who's still trying to catch up to modern games. I'm probably wrong.

[PFV]

Pure form? A cel-shaded polygon is essentially a regular shading polygon that gets an additional rendering pass (among other things, but this is it at it's basest).

Also, cel-shading takes more processing power than more traditional shading methods.

[Sanctine]

Yeah, cel-shading is a type of polygon, though it's not the "pure" form. I was referring to pure computer graphics style.

Maybe by calling cel-shading not "high end" was a bad way to phrase it on my end, but it's just a matter of definition. I'm aware that plenty of work is put into these styles as well, but the fact holds true that many gamers today dismiss them entirely because of their definition of "high end" graphics. What I was saying was that "high quality" and "high end" are two completely separate and unrelated elements of graphics.

Maybe I'm not as technologically savvy as some others around here, but it seems to me that a purely computer graphic-type polygonal game these days is more system intensive than the typical cel-shaded or hand drawn game. CG is usually more "realistic" (depth-wise, not just surface appearance) than the other forms.

But that's from my perspective of a pretty casual gamer who's still trying to catch up to modern games. I'm probably wrong.

Yeah, you don't really know what you're talking about.

I just have no idea where you were going with this argument.

[Zephyr]

Pure form? A cel-shaded polygon is essentially a regular shading polygon that gets an additional rendering pass (among other things, but this is it at it's basest).

Also, cel-shading takes more processing power than more traditional shading methods.

First point, yeah... as in a regular polygon doesn't have the additional redering pass, and additional things. So I called it "pure", since I don't know the technical term for it.

Second, thanks, I didn't know that. Though would you say that a well done cel-shaded game could sacrifice some power and still look good by today's standards whearas one that's not would have to increase power to stay caught up?

Sanctine: I'm not so much as making an argument (as people on message boards often assume, no offense) as discussing the topic. EDIT: AKA, damn my BS'ing didn't work. :(

[PFV]

First point, yeah... as in a regular polygon doesn't have the additional redering pass, and additional things. So I called it "pure", since I don't know the technical term for it.

Well, a "pure" polygon would be lacking more rendering passes than that... :P

Though would you say that a well done cel-shaded game could sacrifice some power and still look good by today's standards whearas one that's not would have to increase power to stay caught up?

I don't think I quite follow what you're asking. What I meant was it takes more graphics processing power to display a model that's features real-time cel-shading than the same model that doesn't.

[thinkfreemind]

Many Japanese RPG fans have already purchased a 360 to play games like Blue Dragon, Lost Odyssey, Eternal Sonata, etc.. and I have no doubt that this trend will continue when they see that the 360 is getting other games they want to play.
What? No. The PS3 is selling much better than the 360 in Japan. Hell, it's even slowly beginning to outsell the 360 here, though I suspect that's only because so many people already have the 360.
I know the PS3 is selling better than the 360 in Japan, duh. All I was saying is that there are about 600,000 X360 owners in Japan. Aside from Ace Combat, those Japanese 360 owners bought the console to play RPGs from MistWalker. In other words, if a Japanese game maker created an RPG for the 360, it wouldn't be a failure in Japan. That's all I'm saying.

[Sayckeone]

I know the PS3 is selling better than the 360 in Japan, duh. All I was saying is that there are about 600,000 X360 owners in Japan. Aside from Ace Combat, those Japanese 360 owners bought the console to play RPGs from MistWalker. In other words, if a Japanese game maker created an RPG for the 360, it wouldn't be a failure in Japan. That's all I'm saying.
And there are 2 million+ PS3 owners in Japan.

The Mistwalker titles for the 360 have already been considered failures in Japan.

As for Zephyr... LOL I'll reply to him tomorrow. I don't feel like reading that... I can't think of a way to describe it without getting banned.

[Sayckeone]

Yeah, you don't really know what you're talking about.
This needs to be quoted.

[massaker]

You say that as if cel shading and hand drawn graphics couldn't possibly be high end.


Yes. Yes I am. The quality of cel-shading can be high, and it can make use of processing power, but by the very nature of the style realism and depth of the visual experience is sacrificed. Unfortunately those are some of the criteria for "high-end graphics" as it is defined by a lot of gamers.

Hand drawn is a no brainer. It's flat. That could be done on much less powerful systems than the PS3, so why charge gamers the price for the power if it's not being used? Yet again, it can be beautiful, but it doesn't take a powerful system to run it.

Basically I'm saying that I want to see more cel-shading and hand-drawn graphics on Wii and the handhelds, and polygons can live on PS3 and 360. The reason? Cost effectiveness. But if PS3 owners make a demand for it, it can of course still be done, and probably will be.

I totally disagree, look at Eternal Sonata and Naruto Rise of a Ninja, there f**** beautiful. You don't have a HD 360 do you?

[Futomimi]

He's arguing for cel-shaded graphics, not against them.

[Sayckeone]

Yeah, but he's saying that cel shading doesn't benefit from a higher resolution/more powerful hardware, which is wrong. Massaker's example helps to show that. There's no way Eternal Sonata would look as amazing as it does on a last gen system.

[massaker]

He's saying Cell shaded graphics can't look high end. I disagreed.

[Futomimi]

Oh, sorry. I thought that massaker just misread and thought he (Zephyr) was saying that cel-shaded graphics didn't look as "good" as in some of the other HD games.

[RTW]

I think that one thing people tend to forget about XBox 360 sales and PS3 sales is that the PS3 came out almost exactly one year after the XBox 360. I honestly think comparing sales of XBox 360 and PS3 is stupid. It's like comparing Logitech brand speakers to JBL brand speakers, the price and quality is just too different to compare the two in sales towards one another, because I can bet you that Logitech sell more of their speakers than JBL just because they are cheaper.

As for RPG's for the PS3, yeah, there aren't many right now, only real one I can think of right now is Folklore which is a pretty decent RPG. And one reason for this is because they keep releasing PS2 games when their 7th generation console is out, I mean the PS2 was great, but I think one reason that the PS3 has been hurt is because the PS2 isn't an obsolete console. When SEGA releases Valkyria Chronicles for the PS3 in the fall, I really think things will change in favor of the PS3 as for a console to place RPG's on. It doesn't help that Microsoft is literally throwing money around to get games such as Lost Odyssey and Blue Dragon.

June 12, is the day that Microsoft will cry. Just because those who don't have a PS3 and love MGS4 will get one. Though, I personally think people should already have a PS3 by now, just because of the fact that it does have some great games already, and Blu(e)-ray.

[System_Error]

June 12, is the day that Microsoft will cry.

June 3 is the day they will laugh.

[Riku Xander]

June 3 is the day they will laugh.
Why?

[Dead to Rights]

^I'm guessing Ninja Gaiden 2, but if the sales of Devil May Cry 4 are anything to go by, they might start crying as well.

[thinkfreemind]

How about next week? I know GT5 Prologue is enough to sell me a PS3 if I had the money.

[Riku Xander]

How about next week? I know GT5 Prologue is enough to sell me a PS3 if I had the money.
I don't really know what I think of Prologue; it is just too realistic for me.

[from_the_depths_420]

I dont know the 360 seems to be a bad choice. If you consider Atlus genral audience. Didn't the 360 RPGs have abysmal sales? I don't agree about the costs.

I mean I'm sure Disgaea 3 didn't cost a lot to make. I am sure they don't HAVE to make the graphics top notch. Frankly I don't think Atlus fans care anyway.

I own a PS3 only so I hope they at least port over the Megaten games :D Tis a shame Atlus games where my favorite series (shame they lost Cozy although folklore wasn't that bad) so if they do I guess I won't get to play them. Oh well I'll live.

[Sayckeone]

(shame they lost Cozy although folklore wasn't that bad)
Yeah... Something's not right here.

[SlaughterX]

I dont know the 360 seems to be a bad choice. If you consider Atlus genral audience. Didn't the 360 RPGs have abysmal sales? I don't agree about the costs.


I heard Lost Odyssey sold well, and it looks like all the Western RPGs (Mass Effect, Oblivion) sold very well too. You can't jsut release any RPG on the system and expect it to sell well, it's like breaking the RPG genre into the PS brand, they need a big game that they can really advertise like FF7 to get peoples attention.

Also I heard DMC4 sold very well on the 360, better than the PS3 version here in the US from what I've heard...

[Sayckeone]

Do you make this stuff up?

Anyway, obviously DMC4 sold better on the 360. There are almost three times as many 360s as PS3s out there.

[Xeo]

This fact isn't helped by knowing that DMC4 requires a manual install to the HDD which not only is 12 gigs big, but also takes about a half an hour to complete. This would be more forgivable if the 360 version had decently long loading times, but it doesn't. It might also be forgivable if after this initial install you didn't need to pop the disc in constantly to play, but you do, though I suppose this is for copyright purposes.

My point is this, this should have been optional, and for the poor saps with a 40gig PS3, 12 gigs is a lot of space for ONE game.

[Domber]

It might also be forgivable if after this initial install you didn't need to pop the disc in constantly to play, but you do, though I suppose this is for copyright purposes.



Wow, that must be a living hell. Maybe someday technology will rise to a level where we wont need to go through the pain and suffering of having to get up, walk across the room and change disks.

Jokes aside, DMC4 is the exception not the rule. Most games don’t require a install like that and even with a 40 gig PS3 you still have far more space than a 20 gig Xbox 360 owner.

[PFV]

12 gigs is a lot of space for ONE game.

4834MB != 12GB

[Xeo]

It might also be forgivable if after this initial install you didn't need to pop the disc in constantly to play, but you do, though I suppose this is for copyright purposes.



Wow, that must be a living hell. Maybe someday technology will rise to a level where we wont need to go through the pain and suffering of having to get up, walk across the room and change disks.

Jokes aside, DMC4 is the exception not the rule. Most games don’t require a install like that and even with a 40 gig PS3 you still have far more space than a 20 gig Xbox 360 owner.

The exception is becoming a fast acting trend.
I might also note I was misinformed about the DMC4 size, as it's about 5gigs, still that's crazy.
Hot Shots Golf 5 is supposed to have a 5gb install, other games of note are Heavenly Sword, Burnout Paradise, etc.

This doesn't sound that bad right now, but imagine how it will look in the long run for 40gb owners. My point is this, that DID hurt PS3 DMC4 sales. It'd be a lot different if it was optional as in the case with games like Ridge Racer 7.

[DarkShear]

12 gigs is a lot of space for ONE game.

4834MB != 12GB

I thought 1,000 MB = 1 GB.

[Saishu]

Technically it's 1024 MB = 1 GB.

I have to remember this fact since I'm majoring in CIS...

[PFV]

I thought 1,000 MB = 1 GB.

1 GB is equal to:
8589934592 bits
1073741824 bytes
1048576KB
1024MB
0.000977TB
0.0000010PB

So, 4834MB != 12GB.

(!= is an equality operator meaning "does not equal.")

[Futomimi]

12 gigs is a lot of space for ONE game.

4834MB != 12GB

I thought 1,000 MB = 1 GB.

DS, even if that were correct, 4834MB = 4 and some GB, not 12. please never attempt math again. :P

[Xeo]

I believe it was in sarcasm, as I put 12gb in my post, when it was actually 4-5gb. I addressed this problem above.

[Marionette]

I really want to see a rpg for the ps3.. sight too bad is not gonna happen now eh?

[Saishu]

Just have to wait and see.

[Sayckeone]

I really want to see a rpg for the ps3.. sight too bad is not gonna happen now eh?
Off the top of my head, I can think of several RPGs being developed for the PS3.

[Sei]

Do tell.

[Futomimi]

DISGAEA!!!11

[Voodoo]

Do tell.

Last Remnant( also 360)
Final Fantasy 13
" " versus 13
White Knight Story
Valkyria Chronicles
fallout 3
Alpha Protocol
Disgaea 3

[Sanctine]

Don't forget Tales of Vesperia. Yes, I went there.

[Voodoo]

Don't forget Tales of Vesperia. Yes, I went there.

Oh and Eternal Sonata as well.

[Marionette]

Yay ! Thanks for the info...Oh Tales of Vesperia @_@

[VMan]

I have to admit I was surprised when Persona 4 wasn't announced for the PS3 (or any current gen console for that matter), but in hindsight, I realize I shouldn't have been so much.

Indeed Persona 4 will have much larger accessibility on the PS2, but I do think the PS3's install base will be much higher by the time Persona 4 is completed and I think P3 being a sleeper hit gave the series a boost in popularity.

I didn't know Eternal Sonata was being ported to PS3, for some reason I thought Microsoft published the game, I guess not.

I just wanna make one comment on the Cell-Shading thing. I think Cell-Shading can looking noticeably more beautiful upgraded with current technology. I think the jump in visual quality from Jet Set Radio on Dreamcast to Jet Set Radio Future on Xbox is evidence to that.

[Flußkönig]

I am planning on getting a ps3 when Valkyria Chronicles hits NA.

If Tales of Vesparia takes as long to port to the ps3 as ES, and it actually gets ported and manages to make it to NA, then good luck waiting till 2010. :lol:

[Marionette]

I totally agree for the Cell-Shading thing . They should make more games with those style.I have to admit I was surprised when Persona 4 wasn't announced for the PS3 (or any current gen console for that matter), but in hindsight, I realize I shouldn't have been so much.

Indeed Persona 4 will have much larger accessibility on the PS2, but I do think the PS3's install base will be much higher by the time Persona 4 is completed and I think P3 being a sleeper hit gave the series a boost in popularity.

I didn't know Eternal Sonata was being ported to PS3, for some reason I thought Microsoft published the game, I guess not.

I just wanna make one comment on the Cell-Shading thing. I think Cell-Shading can looking noticeably more beautiful upgraded with current technology. I think the jump in visual quality from Jet Set Radio on Dreamcast to Jet Set Radio Future on Xbox is evidence to that.

[Tatsuki]

Do you make this stuff up?
No, I don't think he did. LO is probably the first next-gen half-a-million selling JRPG.

At worst, J-RPGs on the 360 sell about the same as they do on the PS3. At best, they sell as well as average franchises on the PS2. Not a bad position at all.

[RayFoxSith]

IMO, I wouldn't really consider LO next-gen. But it is a good game.

[greydrak]

I am planning on getting a ps3 when Valkyria Chronicles hits NA.

If Tales of Vesparia takes as long to port to the ps3 as ES, and it actually gets ported and manages to make it to NA, then good luck waiting till 2010. :lol:

Yeah! I was going to get a PS3 if Valkyria makes it here too!
Though wouldn't Bandai Namco handle Tales of Vesparia if it comes to NA? Don't really think Atlus is gonna be able to get it, and would that be the same with Valkyria too but with Sega?

[Sayckeone]

Sega is localizing Valkyria Chronicles.

As far as ToV, yea, Namco would handle that.

[Marionette]

so Valkyria Chronicles will be come to NA? sweet

[V0LK0V]

I could be misinformed, however I thought the next SMT was announced for PS3.

Not entirely sure, I'll check my sources a bit later.

[Sayckeone]

You're misinformed. Nothing has been said.

[V0LK0V]

http://www.gamespot.com/ps3/rpg/shinmegamitensei/index.html?tag=result;title;6
^ My source.

[Futomimi]

Check the date on that announcement..

[V0LK0V]

Nothing short of the Chronosphere explains this!

[LadyDuoMaxwell]

http://www.gamespot.com/ps3/rpg/shinmegamitensei/index.html?tag=result;title;6
^ My source.

Hope it comes Stateside.

[Sayckeone]

I am sick and tired of posting facepalms pics.

[Pixel]

In that case, you could make Picard your avatar.

[Olethros]

In that case, you could make Picard your avatar.

Why would he want my picture as his avatar?

[Voodoo]

In that case, you could make Picard your avatar.

Why would he want my picture as his avatar?

You should put it up, Olethros

[Olethros]

In that case, you could make Picard your avatar.

Why would he want my picture as his avatar?

You should put it up, Olethros

I was just thinking the same thing. I will probably change it sometime soon. :D

[Pixel]

More discussion about (the lack of) PS3 RPGs:

last year
http://rpgfan.com/editorials/2007/06-20.html

and today
http://rpgfan.com/editorials/2008/06-17.html

[Chronis]

Another reason for the lack of RPGs on the PlayStation 3 may be the fact that the PlayStation 2 is still alive and kicking and developers prefer to tap that HUGE market instead of taking a chance on a PS3 title. On this, Sony is a victim of its own success. So many Sony fans love their PS2 that they don't want to let it go and upgrade to the PS3.

I'm not sure how that is a valid reason. The PS1 was still active until 2004! Yet the PS2 survived and prospered. But I think the biggest reason is that Sony themselves aren't shelling out enough first party games from series people know. Folklore, Uncharted, Resistance, Motorstorm... That's all good but if nobody has played those games before, why do they need to buy a PS3 to try them? They need more sequels. More Ratchel & Clank. More Jak. More Ape Escape. More SOCOM. And make sequels to their own popular RPG series' to show publishers they'll sell. Legend of Dragoon 2. Rogue Galaxy 2.

[Shamanic Enzan]

As long as those sequels have decent stories and aren't just "BUYME" bait. I'm saving up for a PS3 right now, because I've never had a PS2, so I'm looking at the 60 or 80, but it's annoying because some games like Arcana Heart aren't even listed on the PS3 BC List on PS.com.

[Sayckeone]

^You never had a PS2? Jesus, man. What did you play all last gen?

[Shamanic Enzan]

^You never had a PS2? Jesus, man. What did you play all last gen?
Gamecube.

[Sayckeone]

^I'm sorry.

[Animus_19]

I totally agree for the Cell-Shading thing . They should make more games with those style.

I just hope there will be an evolution beyond the cell-shading thing (in the near future). Perhaps PS3 can do it, or PS4 will.

[PainKilleR-[CE]]

I'm not sure how that is a valid reason. The PS1 was still active until 2004! Yet the PS2 survived and prospered.

The PS2 had almost as many releases the month the PS3 hit the US as the PS1 had the year the PS2 was released in the US. Within a year of the PS2's release very few retailers made a habit of carrying a selection of PS1 games (excepting the stores that make most of their money from used games).

But I think the biggest reason is that Sony themselves aren't shelling out enough first party games from series people know.

Sony may have a handful of well-known 1st party titles, but very few of them were the driving force behind their previous consoles' sales (Gran Turismo and Crash Bandicoot are their best-selling series, and the latter can't hold a candle to GTA III/VC/SA or FFVII, though it's close to FFX and VIII). Many of the titles that sold the PS2 in the early years are 2- and 3- console titles in this generation's sequels, or are still in development. GT5 is an expensive demo facing steep competition, GTA IV was dual-released, and 2 Final Fantasy titles are still in development while new titles in the series are available on the PSP, DS, and Wii (and many other SquareEnix titles have been announced for the 360).

On the other hand, Konami is claiming strong sales for MGS4, and an upswing in PS3 hardware sales due to the MGS4 bundle (though with the seemingly limited availability of that bundle I have to wonder how many of those were simply scooped up by the ebay sellers).

The 360 and PS3 hardware sales in the US have stayed in line with one another for most of this year (after the post-XMas plummet). Since most of the major games released this year have been dual-(or tri-) platform, a spike for one because of a game release has been a spike for the other as well. This means that MGS4's addition to the PS3's sales has been significant. Still, with the 360's head start and the fact that Wii's sales seem more related to supply than any particular game releases mean that overall the PS3 is still in the rear, despite selling nearly twice as many consoles in mid-June as the 360, and outselling the Wii (assuming the vgchartz data (http://vgchartz.com/) is correct).

Of course, sales of multi-platform games on the 360 have been roughly twice the PS3 version's sales, which could lead to more developers going towards the 360, even if the PS3 continues to gain in hardware sales. With the best-selling game on the PS3 having not seen a Japanese release, it's hard to say how much the PS3's Japanese hardware base will influence developers (other than Konami, since they have 2 of the top 10 PS3 titles, and the only 3rd party exclusive in the system's top 10). Of course, unless the 360 gets an upgrade to a higher capacity disc a port of MGS4 to the system is going to take a lot of discs.

[Dr Mario Kart]

At worst, J-RPGs on the 360 sell about the same as they do on the PS3. At best, they sell as well as average franchises on the PS2. Not a bad position at all.
The problem is 360/PS3 RPGs and "average franchises" on the PS2 are going to differ dramatically in development costs, as well as the length of the dev cycle.

Thats why that particular 'at best' scenario isnt as great as it might seem.

[Tatsuki]

Thats why that particular 'at best' scenario isnt as great as it might seem.
But that's the situation you're going to get. Neither the PS3 nor the 360 will have titles that outsell the PS2. That is fact.

And don't forget that while development costs are higher, that is also passed on to the consumer as well with higher prices, so profits are higher. 1 million of a 360 JRPG is more revenue than 1 million of a PS2 JRPG, and it'll certainly be comparable to 900K of a PS3 JRPG.

(I know, as my wallet became much lighter than usual from OD this month...)

[Chronis]

$60 games FTL. I think it's bull that higher development costs are passed on to the costumer, especially since PC games are or will use better technology than the PS360. But yet somehow they stay steady at $50. Sure, you can make the argument that PC gamers need to spend more on hardware than console gamers, but companies like Crytek that make the most demanding games don't get revenue from graphics cards sold, or RAM, or hard drives...

[Manly Biceps]

but companies like Crytek that make the most demanding games don't get revenue from graphics cards sold, or RAM, or hard drives...

So they just bundle copies of their games in with those newest video cards and processors out of the goodness of their hearts?

[Chronis]

^^Well, it is the time of giving... *cough*

I actually went to check Amazon about that since I really don't know all that much about PC bundles and whatnot. So yeah, I guess there are exceptions. But if someone can get what they need cheaper than buying a bundle (either get stuff on sale separately or maybe get weaker hardware instead that still gets the job done), THEN the game companies won't get profits from that. From my personal experience, when I bought Balck & White 2 and Battlestations Midway last year, I had to get a better video card. So I went and got a Geforce ssomething or other. As far as I know, neither EVGA or Nvidia gave some money to EA or Eidos because I bought that card for them.

[PFV]

I'm not sure if I misread you, but your GF didn't have software included? Every GPU I've bought has always had software bundled with it. Seems more strange to me that you got one didn't. And I don't buy enthusiast cards (which, to me, should be more likely to have software bundles).

Also, look at how much advertising gets slammed into PC games' intros. I can't tell you how many Intel, ATi, nVidia ads I've spammed my ESC key through while loading a PC game. I imagine that software developers get some revenue for selling ad space within their games.

[Manly Biceps]

^^Well, it is the time of giving... *cough*

I actually went to check Amazon about that since I really don't know all that much about PC bundles and whatnot. So yeah, I guess there are exceptions. But if someone can get what they need cheaper than buying a bundle (either get stuff on sale separately or maybe get weaker hardware instead that still gets the job done), THEN the game companies won't get profits from that. From my personal experience, when I bought Balck & White 2 and Battlestations Midway last year, I had to get a better video card. So I went and got a Geforce ssomething or other. As far as I know, neither EVGA or Nvidia gave some money to EA or Eidos because I bought that card for them.

Not for that game specifically, but I like to buy the "just less than the bleeding edge" card, too. Even though it doesn't come with a copy of THE specific game that motivated me to upgrade it'll come with other games, frequently from the same company. This guaranteed revenue stream for slightly older titles in the PC market just isn't there in the console world.

(Well, it is, but publishers don't get any money from it. Gamestop makes 100% of the cash when you sell them a used title and they resell it, for example.)

[Chronis]

I got nothing with my card. Granted, it was pretty cheap, but not a thing was included.

[Manly Biceps]

I got nothing with my card. Granted, it was pretty cheap, but not a thing was included.

The really cheap-end ones don't, it's true, but that's kind of a minor part of the market.

[slayn]

$60 games FTL. I think it's bull that higher development costs are passed on to the costumer, especially since PC games are or will use better technology than the PS360. But yet somehow they stay steady at $50. Sure, you can make the argument that PC gamers need to spend more on hardware than console gamers, but companies like Crytek that make the most demanding games don't get revenue from graphics cards sold, or RAM, or hard drives...

I would guess that licensing fees for console games are substantially higher than those for PC games.

[PainKilleR-[CE]]

If you have a decent computer shop in your area you can buy "OEM" cards that don't include software bundles. Usually it's about $50 cheaper to buy the cards this way. So the money that developers might get from sales of hardware when their software is bundled comes directly from the consumers, and obviously they don't get money from hardware that isn't bundled with their software.

When you see ads for hardware when a game starts up, it depends on an intricate set of cross-licensing agreements. There may or may not be money involved, as it may just involve advertisements for the hardware including shots of the game, or the hardware's driver developers putting extra work in on optimizations that will improve the game on that hardware.

In the console world the console developer gets cash for every game sold for their platform, because of the licensing agreements for development for the system. It's in the best interest of Sony/MS/Nintendo to get as many developers on board as possible for their system, though obviously first-party development results in more money if they can get good sales. In the PC world, on the other hand, unless you're getting into the "Games for Windows" program or something, there are no licensing fees. You pay for whatever development software and hardware you use (or use free software), and you pay your developers and content producers, and distribution.

Personally, I think the $60 price is BS. The consoles cost enough money as it is, and the only system using a new type of disc is the PS3. Don't even get me started on the price of movies on BD, either.

[masamonkey]

I was actually just reading recently about some game publisher who mostly did PC games and the guy was saying they were making a whole lot more money on budget priced titles than on the $45 - $50 ones because they sold a whole lot more copies of them.

If anything, I'd say that's indicative of the largest factor in next gen sales. Not specifically people buying something cheap over something expensive, but that's a huge factor. More generally, people buy what people are interested in and comfortable with buying. When you add up the investment you're making in a PS3 or 360 in money, time and the gamble you're making on the end product being entertaining, it's not hard to see why a ps2, wii or ds game would be more appealling.

Personally, I don't care about games having whatever a ps3 or 360 has to offer it because I can find those facets of the gameplay experience I'm looking for everywhere else. Bring those prices down and put out more solid content and I'll have more of a comfort zone to work with in making a purchase.

In the meantime, I'll wait to see whether Atlus puts out more titles on 360 or PS3 to give me a serious push in which direction I'll go in getting either of those and continue enjoying my PS2.

[from_the_depths_420]

Actually this year looks good for PS3 with Disgaea 3,and Valkrie Chronicles and Eternal Sonata. Also

http://www.rpgfan.com/news/2008/1285.html

I am really curious what this new NIS game is.I wonder if this means Atlus is coming on board the PS3 as well. Aren't NIS and Atlus close?

[Sayckeone]

^No, they aren't. Besides, that blurb says nothing about what console this new game is for. It's also info coming from NISA, the US publisher, not the Japanese developer. It's most likely not even a PS3 title.

[Sanctine]

Aren't NIS and Atlus close?

Close in that Atlus sometimes distributes NIS' games, yes. I don't see why Atlus would hop on the PS3 train just because NISA is. They don't care. They may have partnered in business, but they aren't drinking buddies.

[from_the_depths_420]

Will Atlus be at Tokyo Game show? Also did they cancel that PS3 Shin Megami Title? I haven't seen any info on it in awhile. Also Atlus need to fire their mods. Whoever keeps messing with my #### is a real cocksucker.

I have had my topics locked, deleted for appertanly no reason at all.Oh well I don't care if I am banned only reason I am here is to promote atlus games. I wish Atlus Japan well. BTW Persona 4 sales now at 200kish!

[Voodoo]

I have had my topics locked, deleted for appertanly no reason at all.Oh well I don't care if I am banned only reason I am here is to promote atlus games. I wish Atlus Japan well. BTW Persona 4 sales now at 200kish!
Thats good since your making a nice start towards it.

[DamnedToBeFree]

lol

[Futomimi]

Also Atlus need to fire their mods. Whoever keeps messing with my #### is a real cocksucker.

I have had my topics locked, deleted for appertanly no reason at all.

hmmm.....

[Kakizaki]

Reset! Seriously enough with the necro posting. If a topic has no activity for two months plus, it is generally a good idea to leave it be. If you are replying to a member that is no longer here or banned, what is the point? Locked.