PVP Tourney BETA

[Karkarov]

Ok as many of you frequent forum goers know by now we are going to attempt to hold a PvP Tournament for Demon's Souls. We met last night and hashed out some different rules and regulations for the event. After the rules themselves I will post a bit of explanation so don't skip the end bits. So without much ado I will get to it...

Rules:

Soul Level: We are asking people to maintain a SL of 120

Gear: The only illegal weapons will be the Scraping Spear, Large Sword of Moonlight, and Blind. All armor and shields are legal. All arrows and bolts are allowed.

Spells and Miracles: The only illegal spells will be Firestorm, Acid Cloud, Cloak, and Soulsucker. As for miracles Wrath of God, Anti Magic Field, Hidden Soul, and Banish will be illegal. Note: Please be careful as the BP with Homing Soul Arrow and try to avoid tagging the host.

Consumables: Each participant is limited to one stack of grass and spice, each stack can have no more than 8 of such item in it. All grass and spice are legal for use. All other consumables can be used in whatever quantity you want and are legal. So you may bring a stack of Ed's Grindstones, Kunai's, Turpentine, etc etc it is perfectly fine. Restocking your consumables between fights is perfectly legal.

Rings: All rings except the Thief's Ring and Graverobber's Ring are legal. Friend's Ring and Foe's Ring count as one item.

Hyper-Mode: Hyper-Mode is perfectly legal but you will be required to start all fights at full health. You can not begin the fight with Hyper-Mode already active.

Switching Gear: You will be allowed two left hand weapons and two right hand weapons. You may have one set of armor and rings. Each consumable slot may be filled as well as all spell/miracle slots. However all equipment is static and you may not change your equipment once you are registered.

Red Eye Stone: You MUST HAVE a Red Eye Stone to participate in the tournament. This is not negotiable.

Conduct: Attacking the host as the BP or "hovering" near the host as a Blue Phantom is illegal. The two opponents must bow to each other before each match and the Host will signal the start by casting Wrath of God. Once a winner is determined the Host will move in for a close up picture and the winner may emote as they see fit. If the Blue Phantom wins the Host will remove them with the White Eye Stone, if the winner is the BP they should exit by quitting the game. Breaking any rules of the tournament, being a sore loser, being a arrogant winner, or just being a jerk in general will get you disqualified from the contest.

Location: The third tourney location is still TBA. The Host will outline the general combat area using Augite of Guidance before the matches begin and will stay on top of the dragon carcass during matches. The two Phantoms are allowed to use the terrain and move about however they see fit so long as they try to remain within the confines of the marked area.

Communication: A Ventrilo server will be used during the fights for communication purposes and there will also be a PSN chat room available but remember there is limited room. The two Phantoms in combat will obviously not be in the chat room or the Vent during their fights.

Tourney Type: This will be a single elimination "win or go home" style tournament. Depending on the number of entrants there may be more than one bracket. Matching will be done in as random a way as possible and will be posted prior to start time. Please understand due to possible no shows and late entries this posting will come as close to the real start time as humanly possible and will not be available very far in advance.

Participation: If you wish to participate in the tournament you must add the Host (Karkarov) to your PSN friends list and must submit a detailed "gear list" of what you will use for the tournament. You will be held to this list and if you use any equipment that you did not list you will be disqualified.

Date/Time: The third tournament will be held on Monday 3/1/10 at 8pm EST. Due to the complications this tournament has had and the short notice on the reschedule registrations are NOT going to be required this time.

To quickly sum up on why the rules are as they are... The point of the tournament is to have fun and allow for a versatile and varied set of builds. What we want to avoid is tactics that are considered overly "cheap", easy to abuse, or simply negate an entire playstyle.

For example it is hard to allow for mage builds at all if mages know going in someone will simply cast Anti Magic sooner or later. On the other hand it isn't very fair to melee style builds who rely on shields to allow for casters to hide behind pillars while doing Firestorm or to make them face a person with a 100% shield bypass weapon. I think the reasons behind no Acid or Scraping are fairly obvious. As for Banish/Soulsucker it is understood you are sort of a newb if you get hit by these but at the same time we do not want to allow one shot kills unless it comes from the business end of a weapon or non gimmick spell and everyone is already risking one SL no need to risk two or more.

The reason for limited grass and spice is fairly obvious but the idea is to give people the chance to heal if needed but avoid the fifteen minute long duel because everyone insists on using grass until they run out. If you can evade your enemy you deserve to stay alive but if all you can do is evade then you are going to lose sooner or later regardless.

Lag, it might become an issue but at the same time it is worth the risk to try this out regardless. Since the maintenance the servers appear more stable (for me at least) so with luck we will be ok.

For those wanting to "spectate" the fights will be recorded and posted in some form one way or another. Don't expect a live feed though.

Again please post your thoughts and feelings on this below. Big thanks go out to Ice Pick and Sferzar who helped make these rules and have been encouraging this event on the forums. You guys reading this better thank them to if you enjoy the event :devil:

[obie191970]

Sounds like a good setup. I'll have to skip the first one seeing my character is only on NG+ and I chose the good ending my first time through and I think I am about 130 or so. I'll start a new build with these tourneys specifically in mind if the first one turns out to be successful and you plan on more.

[Karkarov]

Sounds like a good setup. I'll have to skip the first one seeing my character is only on NG+ and I chose the good ending my first time through and I think I am about 130 or so. I'll start a new build with these tourneys specifically in mind if the first one turns out to be successful and you plan on more.

Like I said, going to be at least a week maybe two before we do this. You should have plenty of time to get someone ready for it if you want.

[Konnect]

Karkarov thanks for posting this sir and many thanks to Ice Pick and Sferzar in helping make the rules as well. Karkarov I will add you to my psn now, do you want me to send you my "gear" in PSN or should I post it here? Obie191970 you can use the same character if you want to, just delevel yourself by having Mephistopheles soulsuck you. He will soulsuck you a total of 4 times before he runs out of MP then let him kill you and repeat.

Thanks again Kark

[obie191970]

Yeah Konnect - I could do that, but I have no interest in messing with my current build. That, and she is a low vit. mage that wouldn't stand a chance in this setup. I need to make a build geared towards the PvP.

[Karkarov]

Karkarov thanks for posting this sir and many thanks to Ice Pick and Sferzar in helping make the rules as well. Karkarov I will add you to my psn now, do you want me to send you my "gear" in PSN or should I post it here? Obie191970 you can use the same character if you want to, just delevel yourself by having Mephistopheles soulsuck you. He will soulsuck you a total of 4 times before he runs out of MP then let him kill you and repeat.

Thanks again Kark

Sure you can do it either way. Thanks for the support!

[Shimizoki]

Best of luck with this, Im gunna skip the first one and see how it goes, that will give me time to build my character at my pace rather than racing to get to 120. But be prepared to see me in the next one xD

[ICE PICK]

ya thx konnect

and great post Kark....i already put a post up on the PSU forums but now that we have this ill link it for them...great job

btw if we do have the vids...if someone wants to email them to me or something i would be more than happy to put them on youtube

[Konnect]

Sorry Obie I know your a vet it wont take long anyways to level up a new character :).

Kark I sent you a friends request as well sir.

[SpiritThief]

Unless the entire level was open I need to start a new character for laters. My toon is pure bow and support magic:tongue:

I like the whole set up tho, I look forward to the vids.

[Konnect]

BTW I didnt see this posted but are you going to allow a 5-10 second grace period to apply buffs or will they be applied during the fight? Thanks

[MonkeySlime808]

im lvl 138 may i enter? and will this be a blue hantom vs red phantom?

[ICE PICK]

im lvl 138 may i enter? and will this be a blue hantom vs red phantom?

u prob need to grind another char...or you can get soul sucked

a dude from the PSU forums LokeSTL wants in on the action.....ill just link the thread i made so you guys can see it for yourselves as it develops http://boardsus.playstation.com/playstation/board/message?board.id=demonssouls&message.id=10511&jump=true#M10511

[Bacon Deity]

Seems radical, but it still brings up the fact that the summoned player is still at a disadvantage right? Because they get spawned as a phantom with less health.

[liquifiedart]

Sounds very interesting.

[Shimizoki]

Seems radical, but it still brings up the fact that the summoned player is still at a disadvantage right? Because they get spawned as a phantom with less health.

the blue will have less heath, but when you summon up the red in soul form it should aswell, atleast that what I was getting from this

[viGx2]

Quick qestion:
Do you just have to start the tourney at SL-120. The reason I ask is I'm curious to what are the rules of winning are? Can that person add a stat or is he/she strictly stuck at 120 for the tourney and the souls can just be used for consumables?

[Bacon Deity]

Seems radical, but it still brings up the fact that the summoned player is still at a disadvantage right? Because they get spawned as a phantom with less health.

the blue will have less heath, but when you summon up the red in soul form it should aswell, atleast that what I was getting from this

Wow, I'm a dumbass... I forgot about that... Phantoms can summon red eye stone player too!

[Shimizoki]

Seems radical, but it still brings up the fact that the summoned player is still at a disadvantage right? Because they get spawned as a phantom with less health.

the blue will have less heath, but when you summon up the red in soul form it should aswell, atleast that what I was getting from this

Wow, I'm a dumbass... I forgot about that... Phantoms can summon red eye stone player too!

Nah, even the best of us slip up sometimes, you just werent thinking on the same wavelength... I forgot how to spell my name eariler... so I'm still 1 up on you

[Sferzar]

Great work Karkarov. I also think we should encourage some mock battles between people abiding by these rules, just so that everyone who enters will be accustomed to the limitations and be able to test out the effectiveness of their build.

EDIT:
Konnect:
BTW I didnt see this posted but are you going to allow a 5-10 second grace period to apply buffs or will they be applied during the fight? Thanks

You know what? I don't think we discussed that. I'll get back to you on that but thank you for bringing up the question.


Do you just have to start the tourney at SL-120. The reason I ask is I'm curious to what are the rules of winning are? Can that person add a stat or is he/she strictly stuck at 120 for the tourney and the souls can just be used for consumables?

You can definitely use the souls to get consumables. Souls Levels? Not so much, we want to keep everyone on equal grounds as much as possible.

[Karkarov]

Double post???? Sorry guys not sure how that happened.

[Karkarov]

Sorry Obie I know your a vet it wont take long anyways to level up a new character :).

Kark I sent you a friends request as well sir.

Ok all thats noted. Don't forget to include what consumables you will bring. We can allow for a short grace period after the bow for buffs, I don't "think" anyone will mind. Don't hold me to it yet though ;p. Just remember that once the fight starts your on your own.

Thanks for the link Ice Pick, I would rather they came over to this forum to be honest since I would like this all consolidated in one place though :/. We will play it by ear.

[Konnect]

Thanks for the response.

[mutilations]

I'm sorry if you guys might have discussed this in secret or whatever but maybe sometime in the future.. have a tourney for users around the soul level of 200.

Before I get the whole "why put two people against each other that can do anything" speech.. keep in mind (and this has been said before) that pitting two high levels that have the possibility for any build type is quite challenging and really makes for good fights.

I've devoted way too much time into my character so I won't de-level him and I won't make a new character to just hurry to get to lvl 120, thus missing out on the farming it took me to get what I needed. That's just how I am and it's no reason to complain. I love the idea I just hope to see some higher level tourneys in the future.. at least before I leave the 200 bracket.

Keep up the good work and planning guys, I hope to see some great footage on YouTube.

[BloodStainedSand]

hm....should be interesting.....I may join in 20 more levels

[Karkarov]

I will repeat again since people dont seem to get it. This will be at least a week, probably two, away. That gives more than enough time to farm whatever it is you need and to get to the proper soul level. I actually would rather people made characters specifically to win than than showed up with their normal guy. In fact I am leveling a guy just to serve as a host character.

Eventually higher level stuff will hopefully get done the reason 120 was chosen because it is an active pvp range with enough levels to allow people to be effective with their builds but also be specific in what they do. All around is ok sure, but a fight between two guys who can do anything isn't as tactical because you don't have a "weakness" to overcome. I admit they count just as much as any other fight and can be fun though.

Bear in mind if you want to be in a pvp tourney though you will have to eventually face reality and understand that you have to stop leveling. I know I have no intention of going past 200 and the vast majority of players probably feel the same. The fact that two threads started talking about how lower level is more fun and one about how there is no pvp over 200 is indicative of this.

[Sferzar]

New character just for this tourney, eh? Interesting.

EDIT: I will go ahead and do that since I am bored.

[ddh4ms]

New character just for this tourney, eh? Interesting.
That too will be my viable option hehe ^.^

@Karv
Grats Karv on finally got this tourney started.
I have a questions, would 'foe ring' and 'friend ring' will be allowed? I was just wondering about that
and... since i havent see the mentioned place, i was wondering will the fight have ring out or range of battlefield kind of thing? uh... i am clueless on to how to find the right word for it

[Shimizoki]

New character just for this tourney, eh? Interesting.
That too will be my viable option hehe ^.^

@Karv
Grats Karv on finally got this tourney started.
I have a questions, would 'foe ring' and 'friend ring' will be allowed? I was just wondering about that
and... since i havent see the mentioned place, i was wondering will the fight have ring out or range of battlefield kind of thing? uh... i am clueless on to how to find the right word for it

boundaries?

[Sferzar]

New character just for this tourney, eh? Interesting.
That too will be my viable option hehe ^.^

@Karv
Grats Karv on finally got this tourney started.
I have a questions, would 'foe ring' and 'friend ring' will be allowed? I was just wondering about that
and... since i havent see the mentioned place, i was wondering will the fight have ring out or range of battlefield kind of thing? uh... i am clueless on to how to find the right word for it

We will use Augite of Guidance to set the range. But basically in world 1-4 you have that courtyard to maneuver in.

[Karkarov]

Foe Ring and Friend Ring are open game, all rings are legal. Just remember you won't always get to be the blue or black phantom depending on how things go.

[ICE PICK]

Foe Ring and Friend Ring are open game, all rings are legal. Just remember you won't always get to be the blue or black phantom depending on how things go.

i think if we choose that ring we should be able to swap them accordingly...all other rings work reguardless of the side, i feel these rings should be counted as 1 ring

[Proteger]

I will be participating in this tournament.Thank you for creating this Tournament Karkarov,you made things interesting :D

[takeste]

i too will be signing up if all goes as planned, already made a new toon and got him to 40 purely for this. should be ready in a week or so...maybe =p

[Izman-Ftw]

I'm sorry if you guys might have discussed this in secret or whatever but maybe sometime in the future.. have a tourney for users around the soul level of 200.

Before I get the whole "why put two people against each other that can do anything" speech.. keep in mind (and this has been said before) that pitting two high levels that have the possibility for any build type is quite challenging and really makes for good fights.

I've devoted way too much time into my character so I won't de-level him and I won't make a new character to just hurry to get to lvl 120, thus missing out on the farming it took me to get what I needed. That's just how I am and it's no reason to complain. I love the idea I just hope to see some higher level tourneys in the future.. at least before I leave the 200 bracket.

Keep up the good work and planning guys, I hope to see some great footage on YouTube.

I agree. After hitting soul level 150 (with 5 million souls saved to prevent over-leveling) i simply wont restart. I recommend you make level groups, ex:

100-120
121-140
141-160

etc, (even though it will make for a wide variety of winners, at least EVERYONE can participate)

Other than that, if a slvl 150 can fit in somewhere, i'd love to join when I get to NG++ :)

[Sferzar]

I'm sorry if you guys might have discussed this in secret or whatever but maybe sometime in the future.. have a tourney for users around the soul level of 200.

Before I get the whole "why put two people against each other that can do anything" speech.. keep in mind (and this has been said before) that pitting two high levels that have the possibility for any build type is quite challenging and really makes for good fights.

I've devoted way too much time into my character so I won't de-level him and I won't make a new character to just hurry to get to lvl 120, thus missing out on the farming it took me to get what I needed. That's just how I am and it's no reason to complain. I love the idea I just hope to see some higher level tourneys in the future.. at least before I leave the 200 bracket.

Keep up the good work and planning guys, I hope to see some great footage on YouTube.

I agree. After hitting soul level 150 (with 5 million souls saved to prevent over-leveling) i simply wont restart. I recommend you make level groups, ex:

100-120
121-140
141-160

etc, (even though it will make for a wide variety of winners, at least EVERYONE can participate)

Other than that, if a slvl 150 can fit in somewhere, i'd love to join when I get to NG++ :)

Thats understandable.

You guys should gather enough people that are at your level to establish your own bracket. Be proactive!

[Karkarov]

bumpage, By the way, assuming some sort of prize could be fabricated for the winner what would people want?

[jedbeetle]

Sounds fun! So, it's confirmed, i'm guessing - simply quitting the game as a black phantom does not drop your soul level? Because using a white stone as a black phantom does.
Also, seems like everyone will probably have a cling ring+another ring? just an assumption...

[Styfer]

This sounds like fun! I made a PvP char that is level 75 right now. Could probably get him up to 120 in time.

[Karkarov]

Sounds fun! So, it's confirmed, i'm guessing - simply quitting the game as a black phantom does not drop your soul level? Because using a white stone as a black phantom does.
Also, seems like everyone will probably have a cling ring+another ring? just an assumption...

Well everyone fighting will be phantom form so yeah most people will probably go Cling + something else. If you quit the game online mode you are simply quitting the game. You don't lose a soul level etc. If you were ultra concerned you could just power off your PS3.

[Sferzar]

Bumping this so that the fifty million people who just joined the forums can see it.

Also, is anyone interested in a couple of duels with yours truly? I want to test a couple of weapon set ups for this tourney.

[ICE PICK]

Bumping this so that the fifty million people who just joined the forums can see it.

Also, is anyone interested in a couple of duels with yours truly? I want to test a couple of weapon set ups for this tourney.

im unavailable for the next hour.....Sons of Anarchy time....but im all about the duels man ill do it with you what specific level? mine arent exactly up to 120 yet (although i have 1 very close) and 1 up and coming pure pvper but hes like 90ish i think)

i have another char thats slipping my mind so once im looking at my menu i can be more specific but ya dude im down for sure

i could use some time to try some things out as well

[ICE PICK]

guess you already found someone?

[Armen9252]

Well I'm out, my level is way to high... :(

Can there be different divisions like 120-129, 130-139 and so on? Because I'm lvl 165.

[BootsElectric]

Hello, everyone! I'm new to the forums (lurker until now. I just never found a reason to post), but lvl 125ish. I'm interested, but my Blacksmith Ed is out to lunch for the next complete game. Once I get to do some upgrades I'll totally be down.

bumpage, By the way, assuming some sort of prize could be fabricated for the winner what would people want?

I don't know how far you are willing to go, but the Delux Edition game would be a spectacular prize to anyone, IMO. I know it's a bit pricey, but everyone involved obviously enjoys the game, it's "collectible" and it just seems like a cool trophy!

Just a suggestion.

[Sferzar]

bumpage, By the way, assuming some sort of prize could be fabricated for the winner what would people want?

We could offer a fancy smancy Sig or something. "Champion of Atlus" or something. Granted we need someone to design it but hey, its an idea.

And Ice Pick, I want to check out how useful my main is in duels, she is level 120 though. I am leveling up another person just for this tourney but I am curious to see how effective my main is.

[ICE PICK]

bumpage, By the way, assuming some sort of prize could be fabricated for the winner what would people want?

We could offer a fancy smancy Sig or something. "Champion of Atlus" or something. Granted we need someone to design it but hey, its an idea.

And Ice Pick, I want to check out how useful my main is in duels, she is level 120 though. I am leveling up another person just for this tourney but I am curious to see how effective my main is.

excellent sounds good to me.....im just always down for pvp practice, its your idea and we can do it however u want, i welcome the experience as well........but 1 idea i had you may or may not like, but to the amount of weaps and different versions/attack styles i though maybe we could bring un upgraded versions and longer battles and see how they meshed with our play styles (or just backoff when one of us gets low health and let eachother heal......more battle time :P, and my guy got to 114 last night)

either way im logging on right now going for another bladestone LOL....if you decide u want to sometime soon shoot me a msg or something

[joest01]

I don't have the time to level my guy up right now and will be out of the country all next week. But I do have the stone and would be interested in a future tournament. Or if there were brackets and I wasn't out of town...

[spunky_chrispi]

sounds awesome!

[jedbeetle]

Do people already run duels in 1-4? I threw my red sign down a few times because I wanted to test the shotal out - (I'm still on the fence about this weapon....it did seem to literally take some guys off guard, but it doesn't do as much damage as my other fast sword...) - and I was summoned by a guy and was attacked by a blue phantom. After I killed the blue phantom, I followed the guy into the anteroom for that level, and he just sat there. I attacked him a few times, but he didn't fight back. Then he went about summoning another phantom. When I attacked him again, he just quit. Is there some dueling etiquette I am missing here? I was actually hoping to lose a soul level in a duel so that I could respec a few levels, just for fun....I did eventually.

[Sferzar]

No I don't think have. It might be best just to ask people on the forums and coordinate duels with them, that way you know that the possibility of you getting screwed isn't so bad.

excellent sounds good to me.....im just always down for pvp practice, its your idea and we can do it however u want, i welcome the experience as well........but 1 idea i had you may or may not like, but to the amount of weaps and different versions/attack styles i though maybe we could bring un upgraded versions and longer battles and see how they meshed with our play styles (or just backoff when one of us gets low health and let eachother heal......more battle time , and my guy got to 114 last night)


That sounds great, I haven't unlocked 1-4 on my current playthrough yet. Do you mind if we duel in world 4-1?

[Leventa]

No I don't think have. It might be best just to ask people on the forums and coordinate duels with them, that way you know that the possibility of you getting screwed isn't so bad.

excellent sounds good to me.....im just always down for pvp practice, its your idea and we can do it however u want, i welcome the experience as well........but 1 idea i had you may or may not like, but to the amount of weaps and different versions/attack styles i though maybe we could bring un upgraded versions and longer battles and see how they meshed with our play styles (or just backoff when one of us gets low health and let eachother heal......more battle time , and my guy got to 114 last night)


That sounds great, I haven't unlocked 1-4 on my current playthrough yet. Do you mind if we duel in world 4-1?

I'd like to try this today, if possible. I'm at level 113 right now. I could use some practice.

[Sferzar]

I will be on tonight Leventa, feel free to add me. Also Ice Pick, we can definitely have those long battles if you like. It isn't like we are battling to the death or whatnot.

[Leventa]

My clock reads 7:43 PM at the time of this post. I should be around and ready between 9pm and 10:30pm or so.

[jedbeetle]

PST here - i'd love to do some practice duels with people in 1-4, but i'm not usually on until around 9:30 pst. My mage is level 120 and ready to go. I want to try out a few different weapon options....

[Leventa]

Friend me Jed and we'll see what we can try.

[Taychon]

how are we supposed to use vent if were on our ps3 cause my comp is far away from my pc

[Sferzar]

how are we supposed to use vent if were on our ps3 cause my comp is far away from my pc

You don't have to vent if its too far from you. I guess you can just use PSN chat or something.

[ICE PICK]

sounds good man....i rented uncharted 2 for the first time today and was playing and wasnt around on the forums for a bit till now.....im about to get on now tho if you're around still

[ICE PICK]

No I don't think have. It might be best just to ask people on the forums and coordinate duels with them, that way you know that the possibility of you getting screwed isn't so bad.

excellent sounds good to me.....im just always down for pvp practice, its your idea and we can do it however u want, i welcome the experience as well........but 1 idea i had you may or may not like, but to the amount of weaps and different versions/attack styles i though maybe we could bring un upgraded versions and longer battles and see how they meshed with our play styles (or just backoff when one of us gets low health and let eachother heal......more battle time , and my guy got to 114 last night)


That sounds great, I haven't unlocked 1-4 on my current playthrough yet. Do you mind if we duel in world 4-1?

ya i didnt mean 1-4 i meant my char is lvl 114, but ya 4-1 is perfect my fav pvp spot

[Sferzar]

Ok so I will be on tonight from 8pm EST to 10pm EST. We can skirmish then. Also, Karkarov, if you read this, have you thought of some kind of reward to the winner?

[takeste]

Ok so I will be on tonight from 8pm EST to 10pm EST. We can skirmish then. Also, Karkarov, if you read this, have you thought of some kind of reward to the winner?

to be immortalized for eternity on the message boards as the guy who beat everyone else up? :p

how many people are are expecting to participate anywho?

[Styfer]

Probably a dumb question but does it matter what NG everyone is in? Can a SL 120 in NG+ summon a SL 120 in NG+++?

[Sferzar]

Probably a dumb question but does it matter what NG everyone is in? Can a SL 120 in NG+ summon a SL 120 in NG+++?

Yeah it doesn't matter. Souls Signs only rely on Soul Level rather than game cycle.

[ICE PICK]

so TONIGHT starts the tourney right? or is it tomarrow?

[Sferzar]

so TONIGHT starts the tourney right? or is it tomarrow?

I gotta talk to Karkarov, to be honest. He has been a little MIA.

[muskellounger]

My rank is too low for this :( But I gotta see some of this. Anyone planning on recording this?

[jedbeetle]

So is the tourney happening?!?!?!

[Proteger]

When will this start?

[Karkarov]

Ok sorry guys for being MIA on the forums last couple days been very busy for me. Here is the skinny, basically I am working right now on getting my capture card working correctly so I can get the footage and make everything work. There was a problem with the shipping so it took longer than I thought it would to begin with and turns out I will need to order some cables to effectively capture the video.... should have triple checked the setup before I ordered so it is my fault there. Once I get it working correctly (shouldn't be long) I am just going to work out the kinks on it and then post a time for the tourney.

However again this gives all the time in the world for people to practice and build that perfect character! So no complaining about not having time to get to the right level ;p

EDIT: To be clear expect a solid time to be posted sometime in the next 3 days. If not sooner.

[jedbeetle]

Ok sorry guys for being MIA on the forums last couple days been very busy for me. Here is the skinny, basically I am working right now on getting my capture card working correctly so I can get the footage and make everything work. There was a problem with the shipping so it took longer than I thought it would to begin with and turns out I will need to order some cables to effectively capture the video.... should have triple checked the setup before I ordered so it is my fault there. Once I get it working correctly (shouldn't be long) I am just going to work out the kinks on it and then post a time for the tourney.

However again this gives all the time in the world for people to practice and build that perfect character! So no complaining about not having time to get to the right level ;p

EDIT: To be clear expect a solid time to be posted sometime in the next 3 days. If not sooner.

So is the SL limit still 120? I got impatient and leveled up. I can de-level I guess...

[Sferzar]

Glad you are back Karkarov. I think a couple of days should be enough to level up my other character, maybe I should use him on the tourney for some good laughs.

[viGx2]

Ok I'm offically at 120. I'll be adding Sferzar and Karkarov tonight and message you guys. Has anything started yet am I to late?

[Sferzar]

Ok I'm offically at 120. I'll be adding Sferzar and Karkarov tonight and message you guys. Has anything started yet am I to late?

You haven't missed anything. Right now Karkarov has been experimenting with his recording equipment so we can get some nice videos of everyone. Especially of me doing down in flames.

[viGx2]

Ok I'm offically at 120. I'll be adding Sferzar and Karkarov tonight and message you guys. Has anything started yet am I to late?

You haven't missed anything. Right now Karkarov has been experimenting with his recording equipment so we can get some nice videos of everyone. Especially of me doing down in flames.


Eggggselent! I'll add you guys when I get off work. Im usually on 10pm until... until i get tired. If you need some more people I'm ready...red eye stone and all.

[Brandon Heat]

I am levelling up a character for this and I'm good to go. PSN Vodkadude

[sanjo900]

I was going to write something long but looking at thes rules the winner will lost likely be a magic user. Sucks to see two things my main uses that will help me have a chance to win in this tournament aren't even allowed( Highly doubt it even if they were allowed). Btw any idiot to cast wrath will be lagstabbed can't beleive you guys won't allow that I would just to get free back stabs if I'm close enough and dodge if not in range as for Firestorm it takes three slots why would a mage waste them on that high costing spell when they spam another for their easy lagtastic win?

[Sferzar]

I was going to write something long but looking at thes rules the winner will lost likely be a magic user. Sucks to see two things my main uses that will help me have a chance to win in this tournament aren't even allowed( Highly doubt it even if they were allowed). Btw any idiot to cast wrath will be lagstabbed can't beleive you guys won't allow that I would just to get free back stabs if I'm close enough and dodge if not in range as for Firestorm it takes three slots why would a mage waste them on that high costing spell when they spam another for their easy lagtastic win?

You have never gotten kited on the pillars in 1-4 have you? Trust us, there is a reason behind each restriction.

[mojie55]

Maybe a silly question. But how do you know everyone wil be SL120. Could someone not level to 129 and because they are within 10 SL's would still be able to be summoned. How will that be regulated?

[Sferzar]

Maybe a silly question. But how do you know everyone wil be SL120. Could someone not level to 129 and because they are within 10 SL's would still be able to be summoned. How will that be regulated?

The host will be level 100 so in theory no one who is higher than 120 should be able to see the blue/red soul signs

Edit: Karkarov has been MIA for a while now. I have started a new character and I should get him to level 100 in several days. If he is still MIA by then, I will go ahead and host it.

[Karkarov]

Sirry Sfer, like I said before been very busy lately. I am now on day 5 in a row working and will get a day off again... sunday ;p? Other things going on as well.... Not really important. I would like to go for a trial run of this on Wednesday the 18th around 8pm EST (thats 5pm PST for west coasters). Please post in this thread if that time is good for you.

If you want to try something sooner than that Sfer go ahead and run with it. What is important is we get the event going and people have fun with it.

[viGx2]

I can do something that weds but not until 9:30ish EST.. Mark me down. I sent you a freinds request. Also have vent.

[Sferzar]

Sirry Sfer, like I said before been very busy lately. I am now on day 5 in a row working and will get a day off again... sunday ;p? Other things going on as well.... Not really important. I would like to go for a trial run of this on Wednesday the 18th around 8pm EST (thats 5pm PST for west coasters). Please post in this thread if that time is good for you.

If you want to try something sooner than that Sfer go ahead and run with it. What is important is we get the event going and people have fun with it.

Nah not at all Karkarov, I know how crazy real life can get.

I was just offering an alternate option for those who were getting rowdy. Anywho, I will absolutely be there next Wednesday at 8pm. I should be ready by then. Will we need to PM you our equipment?

[pktazn]

Wow this sounds interesting. I can't participate cuz my connection is too wonky due to the storms around the area :[

Hopefully this will be a success! Good luck to everyone! :D

[Laziek]

sounds good i need a challenge I've merc enough noobs...
got over 1400 multiplayer sessions...


psn: Laziek

[Laziek]

I was going to write something long but looking at thes rules the winner will lost likely be a magic user. Sucks to see two things my main uses that will help me have a chance to win in this tournament aren't even allowed( Highly doubt it even if they were allowed). Btw any idiot to cast wrath will be lagstabbed can't beleive you guys won't allow that I would just to get free back stabs if I'm close enough and dodge if not in range as for Firestorm it takes three slots why would a mage waste them on that high costing spell when they spam another for their easy lagtastic win?
i agree to you on that fire storms and gods wrath are easy backstabs on noobs who don't know when to use it

[Karkarov]

By Sanjo's way of thinking I would have to outlaw magic period for a mage to not win? Right.... uh I don't think it will be quite that hard for a melee to win it.

I think for this first run we may be a little lighter on the ruleset as far as announcing what you are going to use etc goes because I am not 100% sure how many people we will have yet. Please remember to pm me here, on psn, or do some other zany thing to make sure I know you will be in for this wednesday.

[Brandon Heat]

count me in. VODKADUDE, level 120. i'm central so i'll be on whenever you guys need me. i'm going to try either the Bowar Regen Build, or the Ultra-Cleaver-Dex/Str-Curse DPS Powerhouse build. =)

[Karkarov]

Bumpage. Remeber this is scheduled for tommorrow. Send me a pm on PSN if you can so I know you will make it. The more info I have about who is showing up the smoother things will go when we run it.

[OH-Dae-Su]

this sucks im soul level 130

[OH-Dae-Su]

hey if you would like any one to record the matches for you i would be down to do so...also heres a link to a video just so you can see the quality http://www.youtube.com/user/xburyurdeadx#p/a/u/1/AnwQ_hr-ER0 ps watch in hd

[viGx2]

I was having trouble summoning a black phantom challenger while I had a blue phantom with me last night. So I asked the blue phantom to leave so I could see if it was bc of him being in my world while I was trying to summon a challenger. When he left I was able to summon the challenger immediately. Talked with the challenger after the match to see if he was canceling his red stone sign. He said no, I just kept saying summoning failed. So he challenged me again and this time I had no blue phantom in but was going to try to summon one once the challenger got into my world. I was unable to summon a blue once he entered my world. I hope this is just my connection but has anyone tried to summon a blue phantom once they have a challenger in their world? This could be a problem if red stones are strictly 1v1.

[Karkarov]

I am pretty sure they arent because I have seen complaint posts by people who say they got summoned into three on 1's and such. I personally haven't had a chance to test it yet myself because honestly I have only ever seen like 2 red soul signs while playing. I may try to test this to be 100% sure sometimes today but it will be a little hard to work it out on short notice...

As for video's I am planning to do the capture myself. If you guys want you can check out my youtube page here http://www.youtube.com/user/ElderMasana and let me know if you think thats up to par. I will admit in fullscreen it does lose a little clarity but I think I have gotten it pretty comporable to most DS's vids at this point.

I was hoping to get it closer to real HD but unfortunately I just don't have enough HD write speed to pull it off effectively.

[AgentVoid]

That is some good quality there

[viGx2]

I am pretty sure they arent because I have seen complaint posts by people who say they got summoned into three on 1's and such. I personally haven't had a chance to test it yet myself because honestly I have only ever seen like 2 red soul signs while playing. I may try to test this to be 100% sure sometimes today but it will be a little hard to work it out on short notice...

As for video's I am planning to do the capture myself. If you guys want you can check out my youtube page here http://www.youtube.com/user/ElderMasana and let me know if you think thats up to par. I will admit in fullscreen it does lose a little clarity but I think I have gotten it pretty comporable to most DS's vids at this point.

I was hoping to get it closer to real HD but unfortunately I just don't have enough HD write speed to pull it off effectively.

I hope the 3v1 was when someone used a red stone and not a black stone.

The video quality looks good! I think as long as we can read text it will be fine.

[Taychon]

karkov you havent added me to friends yet so i dont kno if u got my psn message with my gear list

[Karkarov]

Could swear I checked all that earlier well I will be on psn again soon enough so don't worry about it hehe.

Just to throw this out I will be making a chat room called DS PVPT at around 7:30pm or so if you want to participate please send me a pm through psn asking for admittance to the chat. If there are enough people I may need to make more than 1 chat. Also please remember this is a first run it isn't going to be perfect and it will take a little time to set up. If it doesn't start at 8pm on the dot don't panic.

[viGx2]

Great! I was going to have to work late today wont be home until later on. Hope everyone is still playing when I get home. I'll pm you on PSN when I get on. should be around 8 or so central time.

[Taychon]

so i guess this isnt happening tonight as its 10 est

[viGx2]

I got home late last night I hope everything went accordingly. I didn't get home until 815pm central and probably started playing 10 min later until 930. I was in 1-4 just putting down red stones. Got a few challengers. I was in the chat room for a few minutes but I guess I missed everyone. How was the turn out?

[Karkarov]

Not enough attendance unfortunately. Taychon I never got your friend invite I went through my messages twice to be absolutely sure of it. The tourney was supposed to be at 8pm est by the way not 10 ;p! A couple people who said they would participate unfortunately had to pull out for personal reasons earlier in the day so there just weren't enough participants to do it.

I will post another time later on and we can give it a second try. I would still like to hear input on what time is good for people though I am more than happy to just pick something.

[viGx2]

Tuesdays are pretty open for me. But its needs to be later I get off work at 7pm central. I don't know how late you would want to get started. For people on the west coast you would have to start at 10pm for it to be 7pm their time. These time zones are killing this.

Did you get the chance to host any games with a blue and black phantom in your world?

[Karkarov]

No didn't bother it would have been like a two fight tournament not worth it. Again PST players are going to need to deal with it. The absolute latest I am willing to start is 9pm est. I have a job and it happens in the morning. Job beats DS sadly.

[Sferzar]

Sorry I couldn't make it. I was bed-bound the whole week. Let's try this again.

[Karkarov]

Oh we definitely will Sferzar don't worry about that. Not sure I want to try with thanksgiving week coming up though. May wait for the first week of december.

[viGx2]

I did some challenging last night. Did about 10 bouts, 3 of which had multiple blue phantoms. Which voids my theroy that the red stone was only for 1v1. Out of those 3 only one group was respectable enough to have a 1v1. They rest rushed me as soon as I spawned into the world. I only lost 2 fights last night. Suprisingly none with multiple blue phantoms. I lost one to some jerk who waited for me to spawn and was behind me all warding and cleaver buffed and back stabbed me. Luckily I redeemed myself when he accepted my second challenge. All in all it was a great time I got over a million in soul points last night.

Ninja Edit - two --> to

[GuyIncognito]

I did some challenging last night. Did about 10 bouts, 3 of which had multiple blue phantoms. Which voids my theroy that the red stone was only for 1v1. Out of those 3 only one group was respectable enough to have a 1v1.

Black vs blue phantom fight between players in the same geographic region is the only fair fight. Otherwise, lag is always on the host's (the body form player's) side (EDIT: or maybe, not). I'm not going to name names, but the lag-iest player (from Europe) I've encountered prominently appears on the podium upstairs in the Nexus...

Here's when PvP looks like fun (BTW, the war scythe is awesome :) ):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXA8GXXGWAY

[Karkarov]

Decent fight but it drags on for a very long time and it is fairly clear who is going to win from the first 30 seconds depsite the fight lasting almost 9 minutes. Either way that is the basic premise for the event yeah. Organized duels between two people in phantom form, 1v1 only obviously.

[Taychon]

aww man that sucks that u didnt get my friend invite cause it says on my list still waiting for you to respond lol. but whatever so when is it gonna be like the next tournament

[Slazer]

Hey this sounds awesome, if that goes smoothly at all that is. I for sure would like to get in on one of these tourneys. And maybe test the format with some of you guys. Ill add you next time im online Karkarov. Oh yea one more thing, do we need to be exactly level 120 because im level 121. Not that its a problem to fix that.

[viGx2]

Hey this sounds awesome, if that goes smoothly at all that is. I for sure would like to get in on one of these tourneys. And maybe test the format with some of you guys. Ill add you next time im online Karkarov. Oh yea one more thing, do we need to be exactly level 120 because im level 121. Not that its a problem to fix that.

The way we are trying to get it to work is the host will be at SL 100. At that level the host can summon players +/- 20 level of him/her. So in theory the max level that can join would be 120. Technically the host can summon someone who is 80 but the host should know what names to look for when choosing the blue and red stone signs. The host will not fight merely be a witness and hopefully record the event.

[Slazer]

ok thanks man I will get soul drained right away and keep updated on this thread.

[Fandango]

I honestly dont understand why firestorm is banned from the tournament... ive never had a wizz char but ive fought many wizzies before, sure we may die in one hit sometimes but if we grab them they are done.

[Karkarov]

I honestly dont understand why firestorm is banned from the tournament... ive never had a wizz char but ive fought many wizzies before, sure we may die in one hit sometimes but if we grab them they are done.

I tested it in the area where we were going to do the fight. There are too many pillars to hide in making it too easy to get the spell off and it's range when full cast covers most of the area. Also if it hits the mages opponent they are literally dead because the person who gets hit will be knocked down. This is bad because the mage likely has enough mana to cast again immediately leaving the downed guy no chance to recover or dodge. Lastly a SL 120 mage is probably going to be more than capable of a firestorm two shot kill on just about anyone.

Long story short, too easy to abuse. Mages should be ok considering they still have homing soul arrow, soul ray, fireball, etc etc.

[Slazer]

I honestly dont understand why firestorm is banned from the tournament... ive never had a wizz char but ive fought many wizzies before, sure we may die in one hit sometimes but if we grab them they are done.

I tested it in the area where we were going to do the fight. There are too many pillars to hide in making it too easy to get the spell off and it's range when full cast covers most of the area. Also if it hits the mages opponent they are literally dead because the person who gets hit will be knocked down. This is bad because the mage likely has enough mana to cast again immediately leaving the downed guy no chance to recover or dodge. Lastly a SL 120 mage is probably going to be more than capable of a firestorm two shot kill on just about anyone.

Long story short, too easy to abuse. Mages should be ok considering they still have homing soul arrow, soul ray, fireball, etc etc.

Yea i have to agree its very easy to abuse. Sometimes ill go on black eye stone rampages and kill several people in 1 or 2 hits with it. Even though the character i will use in these tourneys is a mage i still am happy with this desicion.

[joest01]

Hah, you people dragging your feet so much has given me a chance to catch up. My soul level is 105 now and rising. I need to unlock 1-4 but that should not be an issue.

The question is, have you ladies had the discipline to stay in that SL window? Or are you all way out of my reach again?

[viGx2]

Im still at 120. I'll make another character before I level up.

[Arutha]

I'll gladly participate if you are going to attempt another session.

I'm 40 level shy of 120 but I'll get there in no time :D


PSN: Zizek, if you want to add me. always available for co-op =)

[Slazer]

Hah, you people dragging your feet so much has given me a chance to catch up. My soul level is 105 now and rising. I need to unlock 1-4 but that should not be an issue.

The question is, have you ladies had the discipline to stay in that SL window? Or are you all way out of my reach again?

No I capped my character at 120 a long time ago.... I actually got soul drained a few times just to get back there. Its also a pretty good level to invade games with.

PSN:SLEGAN add me for co-op

[Karkarov]

Like I said I am going to wait until at least the first week of december. You know thanksgiving is in 2 days yeah? Maybe it is just me but between work and family events I will be a little indisposed for the majority of the next few days :/

However like I said, first week of december sounds good. I just need to confirm my work schedule and I will come up with something. Which I will be doing sometime in the next two days.

[Zizek]

you're allowing warding but not Large sword of moonlight?

Zizek is most displeased.

[joest01]

SL 111 and 1-4 is unlocked!

Now I resent big time that I missed Soulbrand during my first run.

Will take a few days to up my my sharp Flamberge and Tearing Uchi and experiment :D

[Zizek]

joe you need help on 4-1? we're like 2 SL away from eachother.

[Huntrex]

I think this is a great idea. Tho I can't join. I'm in no place to farm. But I hope it turns out well.

[joest01]

joe you need help on 4-1? we're like 2 SL away from eachother.

4-1 is my CRACK :)

I have 1-4 3-2 3-3 and 5-* left

[Karkarov]

Updated the thread with new time for second attempt. Check it out in the inital post. Please send me a pm on PSN if you are going to show up. Yes send a new one even if you sent one before for the first attempt.

[Slazer]

Next Thursday YES right on! That's plenty of time time to make the finishing touches. Ill add you next time im on karkarov. I forgot last time.

[jedbeetle]

Just as a side note, I'd like to see a tourney for lower and higher levels. Even a tourney that allows the full level spread.
It would also be fun to have divisions (i'm not sure exactly what this would look like, but, for example, have a 140-160 division). I have no problem fighting higher level players....

[p1mpnutz43]

who is organizing this tournament is it actually held by demons souls community or just some random ppl who thought of this

[Slazer]

Accident post sry.

[Forsaken]

Bah.
I would definitely join but it's too late for my tastes. (I live in Europe mind you o; )

Oh well, here's hoping next time the tourney will be a tad sooner.

[joest01]

I'm not joining because it's a wee bit too late (small reason) and I'm stuck in a vicious cycle (main reason):


I can't get my sharp weapons to +5
Therefore I sometimes still rely on my Demonbrand
I missed pulling the Soulbrand out the ground
So, I can't invade very much without risking my white tendency\
Which means I don't get nearly enough practice in pvp right now


Frustratedly yours

J.

[Karkarov]

It is just a pvp fight guys, if you lose you lose, it happens. It isn't like you are risking anything other than a soul level which will take like... 5-10 minutes of grinding to recover. I would like to host it earlier myself as well but sadly most of the people interested have made it clear they want it later in the evening not early.

[Slazer]

Im not exactly sure why you are choosing to make the tournament for lvl 120's, not that there is a problem with that. I do think we might get a higher turnout if the level is dropped maybe to 80 or so. I only think that because now that im over lvl 100 i find its at least 2 times as hard to invade or see blue phantoms. I think alot of people cap pvp characters at 80 or even lower because of how easy it is to invade at that level. My lvl 180 never sees any action basically so i gave up on that character and decided to only go up to level 120 now with all my chars. And I only go that high so i can join the tourney you guys are setting up. Sorry if it sounds like im complaining i dont mean to and i appreciate the fact you are setting this up its just a suggestion.

[psn_brian]

Hey guys,

I'd like to join this, but I've been away for vacation, and won't have time before Thursday to make a new level 120 character.

Just a couple comments about the rules:

-If this is going to become an ongoing, serious thing, then you guys are rushing way too fast to ban stuff. Why don't you let firestorm be legal, and actually wait to see if the top couple finishers in the tourney actually end up using it? LSoM does crappy damage, and in any case, someone using a shield should be forced to adapt to it if that's what they run into. The only things I could imagine banning are acid cloud/scraping spear, because they will make dueling annoyingly expensive, and anti-magic, because it instantly kills any mage.

- I don't think you should be allowing buffs to be cast prefight. There's a reason they have a startup; if you want to cast them, you take a risk. Also, having a buff period prefight leads to an annoying issue that the fight had better start right away when you expect, otherwise you lose precious seconds from your buff. This could be fixed by having the host cast God's Wrath twice; once to signal the buff period, and once to start the fight (at a fixed interval) but anyway, this seems dumb to me.

-I think you should allow changing of equipment mid fight. This would allow for adaptation, and of course, attempting to change your clothes on the fly carries a huge risk. Basically, in line with what I was saying above, if something's in the game, don't ban it unless it obviously breaks something, or has proven to be too good in past tournaments.

- Friend's Ring and Foe's Ring should be considered one item.

- You should probably ban de-leveling a character's stat points to less than their default values. Otherwise, it's automatically the best strategy to delevel your luck and any other unused stats to 1, for example. This makes it too much of a hassle to make new builds for future toruneys imo. Otoh, I don't know how you would monitor this, so it might not be realistic to do this. If it's not banned, rest assured I will be taking advantage of this in any future tourney ;).

[viGx2]

So Karkarov, any updates on when the next event will be happening? I've created a second character I think I could reach 100 to also host games in a week or so. But I still have a build at 120 for pvp.

Edit:

Didn't realize you edit your first post. 12/3/09 this thrusday you say. I'll pm you on psn.

[Karkarov]

-If this is going to become an ongoing, serious thing, then you guys are rushing way too fast to ban stuff. Why don't you let firestorm be legal, and actually wait to see if the top couple finishers in the tourney actually end up using it? LSoM does crappy damage, and in any case, someone using a shield should be forced to adapt to it if that's what they run into. The only things I could imagine banning are acid cloud/scraping spear, because they will make dueling annoyingly expensive, and anti-magic, because it instantly kills any mage.

I have explained why firestorm and gods wrath were banned numerous times. If the tournament happens in a different area later on this might change but at the dragon carcass in 1-4 they are going to be illegal. I also said why the LSoM and Blind were illegal in the first post. Nothing that negates an entire playstyle will be allowed. The idea is for ongoing tournaments yeap.

- I don't think you should be allowing buffs to be cast prefight. There's a reason they have a startup; if you want to cast them, you take a risk. Also, having a buff period prefight leads to an annoying issue that the fight had better start right away when you expect, otherwise you lose precious seconds from your buff. This could be fixed by having the host cast God's Wrath twice; once to signal the buff period, and once to start the fight (at a fixed interval) but anyway, this seems dumb to me.

I don't recall agreeing to that I seem to remember saying I would think about it. I don't see a mention of it in the rules. If I didn't change the rules to say it I wouldn't expect to see it in practice.

-I think you should allow changing of equipment mid fight. This would allow for adaptation, and of course, attempting to change your clothes on the fly carries a huge risk. Basically, in line with what I was saying above, if something's in the game, don't ban it unless it obviously breaks something, or has proven to be too good in past tournaments.

Uh no. You decide what you want to use going in. If your opponent is so bad they let you escape long enough to go into your inventory and start swapping items they probably deserve to lose but why push it?

- Friend's Ring and Foe's Ring should be considered one item.

Pretty sure we said in here we would do that somewhere. I will clarify the rules to be specific. Hopefully the cookie cutters don't come out of the woodwork.

- You should probably ban de-leveling a character's stat points to less than their default values. Otherwise, it's automatically the best strategy to delevel your luck and any other unused stats to 1, for example. This makes it too much of a hassle to make new builds for future toruneys imo. Otoh, I don't know how you would monitor this, so it might not be realistic to do this. If it's not banned, rest assured I will be taking advantage of this in any future tourney ;).

That bug got patched a long time ago. Supposedly luck will never go down anymore no matter what you try in fact. Meanwhile I don't really care if people do it, it isn't like anyone can free up more than a few stat points on a new character. Highest starter level is 9 after all. A few stat points mean jack when compared to skill in Demon's Souls.

And yes it would basically be impossible to monitor anyway.

[psn_brian]

I have explained why firestorm and gods wrath were banned numerous times. If the tournament happens in a different area later on this might change but at the dragon carcass in 1-4 they are going to be illegal. I also said why the LSoM and Blind were illegal in the first post. Nothing that negates an entire playstyle will be allowed. The idea is for ongoing tournaments yeap.

All Im saying is that, you're being too quick to institute these bans. Sure, you've made some theoretical arguments that firestorm and Wrath will be overpowered, but I don't think that will be clear until you actually see 3 firestorm mages in the top 3 in your tourneys. Instituting all these bans from the get go doesnt allow a metagame to develop naturally, you're basically deciding what kind of fights you want to see at the start.
In competitive gaming, bans should be an absolute last resort.. I think you're throwing them around much too liberally. LSoM does crap damage, I'm not even convinced someone using it would win against a tank build with tons of defense and a +5 tower shield. Just as long as the tank can deal some damage himself.. Maybe I'm wrong of course, but that's something that should be answered naturally through gameplay.




Uh no. You decide what you want to use going in. If your opponent is so bad they let you escape long enough to go into your inventory and start swapping items they probably deserve to lose but why push it?


Again, why change the natural, programmed in rules of the game for an issue you admit probably doesnt break anything?




That bug got patched a long time ago. Supposedly luck will never go down anymore no matter what you try in fact. Meanwhile I don't really care if people do it, it isn't like anyone can free up more than a few stat points on a new character. Highest starter level is 9 after all. A few stat points mean jack when compared to skill in Demon's Souls.

And yes it would basically be impossible to monitor anyway.

I see. I knew about the patch, but I thought it was just to prevent going to level -99. I figured going to level 1 would still be possible, but havent tried it. Are you sure?

Edit: poking around on the web, it looks like you're right about this one.
Further edit: I just want to note that in spite of my above criticisms, I think its great that you're taking the time to organize this, and I look forward to participating in future tourneys :).

[joest01]

OK, I finally said screw Demonbrand and invaded a little last night. Can't say that the level of challenge I experienced makes me feel any more prepared than before.

But, though I won't have time log into the game today at all, I will be game and try to make time and play cannon fodder if you guys need another player tomorrow. My psn is joest01. I'll pm you list of equipment if you confirm.

[Slazer]

PSN Slegan

I just added u karkarov and sent you a list of my equip

[Karkarov]

Long story short.

Firestorm was tested in the area where the fights will take place, it is way too easy to simply rope a dope a guy into chasing you around a pillar while you cast making it very easy to get the spell off. Once it is cast the area it covers is massive in relation to the width of the room and if the first cast hits it is basically game over right there unless the caster doesn't have the mana to cast twice (highly unlikely). In other words it is too easy to abuse in this area and I say again if the next tournaments take place in a different spot it may be allowed but not in that room in 1-4.

As for the Large Sword of Moonlight I am just going to have to assume you never fought a high faith build with a +5 version of it because trust me it can hit just fine in the right hands. Regardless a weapon which totally mitigates shields is a massive kick to the crotch of anyone who incorporates shields into their character so I am not going to allow them. Meanwhile you will notice the shotel which has 50% shield bypass is legal.

As for why not change it? Because the whole point is to make people design a specific build around specific weapons and tactics for a pvp tournament. This is not about open unorganized pvp where "anything goes". Fighting with restrictions proves the difference between a one trick pony and a person who is actually good at the game. Any idiot can win with a firestorm ambush or by using a meat cleaver as a BP while standing beside graverobber blige.

[Cyon210]

Karkarov, I am in. All the rules just fantastic.

[Slazer]

Is there a link for this ventrilo server? or will you give it to us before the tourney starts?

[Karkarov]

Is there a link for this ventrilo server? or will you give it to us before the tourney starts?

Going to give it before the tourney starts. I may post it here may post it in a psn chat.

[MHguyDre]

I would like to participate in this tourney im new to these forums and have a knight SL 127

[MHguyDre]

hehe... I'll show you all my strength...

[joest01]

No idea what a Ventrilo server is and I just checked the clients not available for Linux. So I guess I'll just let my frowned upon Mirdan do the talking.

[Karkarov]

No idea what a Ventrilo server is and I just checked the clients not available for Linux. So I guess I'll just let my frowned upon Mirdan do the talking.

Thats fine too I am going to have at least one chat room going regardless.

Also again people please please please send me a PM on PSN telling me if you intend to enter the tournament or a PM here. If you want to participate you absolutely must send me a PSN friends request as well. If you do send one do not cancel it just because I don't accept it within a day I don't play my PS3 every day you know.

[MHguyDre]

Ok I will add you im on NG++ and sl 127 is this good to participate

[Karkarov]

Ok I will add you im on NG++ and sl 127 is this good to participate

Would really prefer 120, send me the friend invite and we will see as things go. I MIGHT allow some leeway depending on how many people show up.

[MHguyDre]

K that's my only char and to delevel 7 lvs is a lot and if I lose that's another due to the red eye stone

[MHguyDre]

k that is my only char so id rather not de level

[Karkarov]

Going to start sending invites to the chat room in roughly 10 minutes, if you want to participate but have still not bothered sending that friend request or saying so now would be the time.

[WitheredHand]

Is there a live video feed going on by chance?

[Karkarov]

Is there a live video feed going on by chance?

Nope good thing too because we took an hour delay because I kept getting repeatedly invaded by black eye stones ;p. I think there was 6-7 overall by the end of the night. Either way 4 fighters showed up, unfortunately one of them had to leave after the event began. To compensate I made each match a best of 3 rounds so they weren't over in a flash and switched it up to two losses and you were out. In the end there were some very good fights that got quite close and I am overall pleased.

For the record the winner was Frartel who used a heavy magic/caster build. Yes casters can kill you even without firestorm apparently.

Once I have the video's properly edited and assembled I will be uploading them to my youtube page. Expect a link in the next couple of days if all things go well. I am hoping they will motivate a little bit more attendance for the next event.

[Cyon210]

I can't make it to this tourney but looking forward for the next one.

[Slazer]

Despite the amount of people in the tourney it was still loads of fun. So if anyone is thinking of joining but are not sure go for it. If we had lots of people for a tourney like that it might be too much for 1 host to handle though dont you think? Just because of the random invasions and occasional time where you cant see the eye stones.I dont know if we will get a big turnout or not but if we do i would be willing to host if there are too many players. Although im not sure what the best way to record it would be I dont own any devices for that. But of course if you want to record them all yourself or have someone else that would help then great.

[psn_brian]

The random invasions sound like a pretty annoying problem if this becomes more popular. Perhaps this could be solved by changing the level requirement to 150+?

[joest01]

Lol if videos ever show up please think of me as the rodeo clown.

And in my defense, I lost an END point after each loss :D

[Slazer]

The random invasions sound like a pretty annoying problem if this becomes more popular. Perhaps this could be solved by changing the level requirement to 150+?

Yea that might help i think it being at lvl 120 is perfect for everything else other than the invasions. I guess for lvl 120 you just need to summon the red eye right off the bat. I still would like to try another at lvl 120 just so we can get a bigger tourney 1st. Considering how small the turnout was i dont think we should move on from the 120 lvl just yet. Also im not totally sure but I think that more people have characters at lvl 120 or even lower so i think we could get a bigger turnout. Dont get me wrong I have seen alot of people saying that they had higher lvl characters as well.

[Karkarov]

Actually the guy I used to host wasn't 100 because I knew some people would be a few levels over and I wanted to be sure I would have leeway to get them so I brought a slightly higher level guy. Believe it or not I confirmed my level range earlier in the day with some tests and I was asking everyone I invaded or got invaded by their levels. I was running into people anywhere from 118 to 170, no I am not kidding.

Encoding the first vid now. Should come out to be about 1.1 or 1.2 gig in size and will run about eight and a half minutes.

The BGM is a trance mix by Dj Tiesto. Hope you guys can dig that sort of stuff ;p

EDIT: Just watched the entire finished product, assuming it doesn't lose much quality going to youtube it should look very nice played in HD. 3-4 hours and it should be live in full quality, baring a "hiccup".

[WitheredHand]

Can't wait to see it.

[Karkarov]

Yeesh doing a final pass on the finished vid and noticed a big typo... well hopefully no one will catch it ahahaha!

[WitheredHand]

You misspelled Demon's Souls.....hahaha

[WitheredHand]

Just kidding, thought that would be a funny one though.

[Karkarov]

Nah I use a still image at points with a graph to show who won what match and I misspelled one of the names in it. Transposed two letters, stupid letters. And despite editing the text pop ups like 10+ times per pop up I think I may have made that same typo in one of them :/

Oh well if the upload explodes on me I will fix it. If not I just get to look dumb. The vid will still be good regardless.

[Taychon]

karkov post whenever ur playin so u can try and add me 4 the tourney

[Slazer]

Actually the guy I used to host wasn't 100 because I knew some people would be a few levels over and I wanted to be sure I would have leeway to get them so I brought a slightly higher level guy. Believe it or not I confirmed my level range earlier in the day with some tests and I was asking everyone I invaded or got invaded by their levels. I was running into people anywhere from 118 to 170, no I am not kidding.

Encoding the first vid now. Should come out to be about 1.1 or 1.2 gig in size and will run about eight and a half minutes.

The BGM is a trance mix by Dj Tiesto. Hope you guys can dig that sort of stuff ;p

EDIT: Just watched the entire finished product, assuming it doesn't lose much quality going to youtube it should look very nice played in HD. 3-4 hours and it should be live in full quality, baring a "hiccup".

Damn lvl 170 thats outrageous, im going to start asking everyone I play with what level they are. I always thought about doing it earlier but now I actually have some motivation. I heard of someone saying he was lvl 91 and he helped someone who was lvl 32 or something.

ps. Thansks karkarov for recording those I cant wait to see them.

[Karkarov]

Ok the vid is up and being processed now, the original upload went through so there will be a typo in it :/ but we will live. Next time I will be more vigilant. Sadly I also got hit with an ad popup because of the track I chose which is fairly lame since the whole thing doesn't play to begin with. Just make sure to close it as soon as you see it and it should be ok. Once it finishes processing I will probably start a new thread with a link to it.

[n3wpain]

awesome

[Callo Malus]

Aww man, I've been reading through all the Story, Gameplay, and Strategy section of the forum for a couple weeks now (trying to find discussions of the story and finding very little) and totally missed that there was a PvP Tournament. I'd love to do this when the next one happens. My main character, Callo Mallus, is some levels above 120 currently so I'd probably de-level him a bit. I'll keep my eyes open on this thread.

Also, looking forward to seeing the videos of the previous tourney.

[Karkarov]

Just so people know I am planning to do more of these for sure. Probably sometime in early january with christmas coming up the timing would be bad to do it any sooner.

[Slazer]

Im not 100% sure but I think in the videos that dstaikai took for the japanese tourneys all the participants were high level probably like 180 or something. And every fight with the exception of a few take forever. I think this lvl 120 style you set up works alot better. I watched 1 video and someone landed 3 backstabs in a row on someone! 3 wtf he didnt even die after that. Back stabs are tough to land against a good player. I think careful calculated moves like backstabs deserve more than that. The guy just ran away after and probably used a dark moon grass and all of those nice backstabs went to waste. How frustrating would that be? Sure dont get me wrong if someone bases there character around VIT then they deserve to live after a couple backstabs but if everyone has super high hp then the matches will just drag on and on. I dont think that would even be fun, just an annoying chore. Either that or only allow a very small amount of healing items.

[sanjo900]

Im not 100% sure but I think in the videos that dstaikai took for the japanese tourneys all the participants were high level probably like 180 or something. And every fight with the exception of a few take forever. I think this lvl 120 style you set up works alot better. I watched 1 video and someone landed 3 backstabs in a row on someone! 3 wtf he didnt even die after that. Back stabs are tough to land against a good player. I think careful calculated moves like backstabs deserve more than that. The guy just ran away after and probably used a dark moon grass and all of those nice backstabs went to waste. How frustrating would that be? Sure dont get me wrong if someone bases there character around VIT then they deserve to live after a couple backstabs but if everyone has super high hp then the matches will just drag on and on. I dont think that would even be fun, just an annoying chore. Either that or only allow a very small amount of healing items.

Who the hell bases their character around VIT <_< you only get 1900 in the end and that can't even survive 3 backstabs I'm pretty sure one of them didn't even count but still did the animation for it that happens a lot with lag phantoms. So even if the Sl were higher it'll still be practically the same thing, Sl150 seems perfect IMo since all of the characters I made seem more complete at that level and didn't seem to need anything else.

[Karkarov]

Actually since you guys mention lag and backstabs I am finishing the cut on the final part of the tournament tonight and posting it. The reason this is relevant is because at one point in the vid Frartel lands a backstab on Slegan and you can see from his health bar when it happens he takes absolutely no damage from it ;p.

[Slazer]

Im not 100% sure but I think in the videos that dstaikai took for the japanese tourneys all the participants were high level probably like 180 or something. And every fight with the exception of a few take forever. I think this lvl 120 style you set up works alot better. I watched 1 video and someone landed 3 backstabs in a row on someone! 3 wtf he didnt even die after that. Back stabs are tough to land against a good player. I think careful calculated moves like backstabs deserve more than that. The guy just ran away after and probably used a dark moon grass and all of those nice backstabs went to waste. How frustrating would that be? Sure dont get me wrong if someone bases there character around VIT then they deserve to live after a couple backstabs but if everyone has super high hp then the matches will just drag on and on. I dont think that would even be fun, just an annoying chore. Either that or only allow a very small amount of healing items.

Who the hell bases their character around VIT <_< you only get 1900 in the end and that can't even survive 3 backstabs I'm pretty sure one of them didn't even count but still did the animation for it that happens a lot with lag phantoms. So even if the Sl were higher it'll still be practically the same thing, Sl150 seems perfect IMo since all of the characters I made seem more complete at that level and didn't seem to need anything else.

Well i have seen 2 guides on this forum for pvp characters and both of them have 70 vit. So maybe you should check those out. And obviously any character that decides to be a NR pvp player is going to LOAD up his/her VIT.
And an extra 200-300 health makes a HUGE difference. The difference of dying in 1 or 2 hits is EVERYTHING in this game it makes all the difference. However you may be correct about the lag phantom thing i guess. I didnt think it was lag because the backstabs all looked like they landed perfectly but maybe not.

[Drench]

Karkarov! Fantastic videos sir! I'm new to the boards so completely missed this but that is totally fine! I'll be involved in the next one :D I would like to formally offer up some incentives for the following tournaments. I have some extra Pure bladestones laying about and although some people may already have them they are still of great trade value. Maybe a Pure for the win and something different I can offer for second. I still see a LOT of posts from people in the low 100's looking for it so maybe can incite some fun and excitement from people that might not otherwise attend :P Call it a small bribe to get in there and kick some ass hehe.

[Slazer]

Karkarov! Fantastic videos sir! I'm new to the boards so completely missed this but that is totally fine! I'll be involved in the next one :D I would like to formally offer up some incentives for the following tournaments. I have some extra Pure bladestones laying about and although some people may already have them they are still of great trade value. Maybe a Pure for the win and something different I can offer for second. I still see a LOT of posts from people in the low 100's looking for it so maybe can incite some fun and excitement from people that might not otherwise attend :P Call it a small bribe to get in there and kick some ass hehe.

BRILLIANT!!!! lol anything that brings more people is a great idea.

[Karkarov]

Karkarov! Fantastic videos sir! I'm new to the boards so completely missed this but that is totally fine! I'll be involved in the next one :D I would like to formally offer up some incentives for the following tournaments. I have some extra Pure bladestones laying about and although some people may already have them they are still of great trade value. Maybe a Pure for the win and something different I can offer for second. I still see a LOT of posts from people in the low 100's looking for it so maybe can incite some fun and excitement from people that might not otherwise attend :P Call it a small bribe to get in there and kick some ass hehe.

Thanks I also agree that this is a good idea, I even already tossed around the concept of rewards for the winners. Make sure to check the vids again I just made the climatic final round vid public!

In other news expect an announcement about the next tourney's date and time to be soon. Again, odds are it will be sometime in the first week of January.

[Dominions]

Im not 100% sure but I think in the videos that dstaikai took for the japanese tourneys all the participants were high level probably like 180 or something. And every fight with the exception of a few take forever. I think this lvl 120 style you set up works alot better. I watched 1 video and someone landed 3 backstabs in a row on someone! 3 wtf he didnt even die after that. Back stabs are tough to land against a good player. I think careful calculated moves like backstabs deserve more than that. The guy just ran away after and probably used a dark moon grass and all of those nice backstabs went to waste. How frustrating would that be? Sure dont get me wrong if someone bases there character around VIT then they deserve to live after a couple backstabs but if everyone has super high hp then the matches will just drag on and on. I dont think that would even be fun, just an annoying chore. Either that or only allow a very small amount of healing items.

High level PvP is a lot more demanding than low-level. It's just a game of Who Has More Grass if you hack away mindlessly, while that's not a bad strategy around lv100 since weapon damage is high but almost completely static.

Poison/plague statuses (and resistances to them) are critical because you've got to keep the opponent's healing at half-rate.
Magic and Enchantment damage is the only thing that scales anywhere on par with HP + Regeneration/Second Chance + Healing + Defense.
With spells being such a significant part of strategy for casters and fighters alike, hello Anti-Magic.

In melee it's viable (if not necessary) to push in order to open an opponent for direct hits or attempt parry/riposte. Your opponent is tough enough that you need the extra damage, and you're tough enough that it's not game over if you blow your attempt.

PS for the tournament, were there any rules for competitor CT? It would suck to be black/white and get summoned as the wrong phantom type.

[joest01]

No, I came with pure white as it gives you more health (and b/c I killed Yuria before I got the foes ring)... But it did hurt attack power as the BP for sure.

Edit: but Karkarov is right, there is no way to solve this and skill, or lack thereof, is of infinitely greater impact.

EditEdit: as is patience, and, especially, lack thereof :D

[Karkarov]

PS for the tournament, were there any rules for competitor CT? It would suck to be black/white and get summoned as the wrong phantom type.

Not not really, but again in Demon's Souls skill is the main factor not your phantom effects and a couple total stats difference. In a tournament with a large number of participants (say 8 or more) working this out would be near impossible to boot. Someone has to be the blue phantom and someone has to be the black one, the end. Sooner or later two white CT guys will fight or two BT will, it is an inevitable issue but again skill should prove more decisive.

[Dominions]

Not not really, but again in Demon's Souls skill is the main factor not your phantom effects and a couple total stats difference. In a tournament with a large number of participants (say 8 or more) working this out would be near impossible to boot. Someone has to be the blue phantom and someone has to be the black one, the end. Sooner or later two white CT guys will fight or two BT will, it is an inevitable issue but again skill should prove more decisive.

I agree there's not much you can do about it, but I do think the differences are pretty significant... HP especially, it's 60% vs 40% for white CT vs black... that's effectively a free Cling Ring or Second Chance.
That might be enough to require that all participants should be White CT just out of self-interest, it's certainly more statistically significant than anything else could possibly be. As an invader you would just be missing out on a damage buff.

Is red stone summoning any different? I know you can drop them in human form, do you show up with full HP?

[joest01]

... I know you can drop them in human form ...

WHAT??? Really??

Edit: looked it up, here's the quote from the (old) wiki:
offer yourself to be summoned for PvP duel with host as a black phantom, when used in body form, you will be transported to the duel in soul form, with the known lower HP values of course, in case you die, you will return to body form, regardless.

[Karkarov]

I really do understand where you are coming from Dominions but I have people raising a stink over it being soul level 120 and firestorm being illegal... I dont even want to consider how bad it would get if I said they had to have a specific character tendency which I have no way of proving or checking to begin with.

I want the event to be fair but people need to deal with reality. Because even if you try to make the playing field as level as possible there will always be "something" that shifts it a bit one way or the other no matter what you do.

[Dominions]

I want the event to be fair but people need to deal with reality. Because even if you try to make the playing field as level as possible there will always be "something" that shifts it a bit one way or the other no matter what you do.

I was thinking yesterday that there's no way to check. If you wanted to be as fair as possible, I guess you could have competitors fight first as blue/black and then as black/blue. Of course that would probably be inconvenient to do, doesn't help when you need a third match to break a tie.

I think most players will be white CT since that's the biggest competitive advantage. It doesn't help much that any player who wins as a black phantom is going to alter their CT towards dark and lose HP cap.

Keeping things even is gonna be a real headache.

How did you even get the invading player? Red stone?

[joest01]

How did you even get the invading player? Red stone?

Yes we put down red and blue signs respectively for karkarov to summon us

[Dominions]

How did you even get the invading player? Red stone?

Yes we put down red and blue signs respectively for karkarov to summon us

So levels were on the line too... that's a bad-ass tourney.

[Karkarov]

How did you even get the invading player? Red stone?

Yes we put down red and blue signs respectively for karkarov to summon us

So levels were on the line too... that's a bad-ass tourney.

I actually allowed people to soul suck me a couple times to compensate. But in a "big" tourney that wouldn't really be an option. I can't afford to let myself get soul sucked like 15 times or I won't be in range anymore ;p.

[Dominions]

I actually allowed people to soul suck me a couple times to compensate. But in a "big" tourney that wouldn't really be an option. I can't afford to let myself get soul sucked like 15 times or I won't be in range anymore ;p.

lol that's a nice gesture but I don't think it's fair that you have to pay for other people's losses. Fighting for character levels would keep your participation down to a reasonable level, I think.

[Slazer]

Would you ever be willing to change the rule that makes u keep equipment on the entire tournament? I dont know if its out of the question or not. But my new dex build has several different styles of play for different enemies. Like dual uchis, war scythe, kilij or shotel. It would be so hard to pick what to use. If i had to choose it would be kilij and war scythe just because it seems like a safe bet to me. But getting to use any of them any fight would be much more fun. It would make the tournaments much much more fun to watch IMO and i hope others would agree.:lovefirefox:

[CUR715]

Hey! Let me know if another tournament kicks off in the future.

I have the US version now, but more importantly i have 700+ hours and 2000+ MP games on the Asian servers under my belt, so i'd love to see how you lot are playing it compared to the Japanese.

I only have one build at the moment, more magic based. But creating another for PvP shouldn't be a problem, given enough notice.

[Karkarov]

There will be another tournament likely in early january. I am not going to change the rule on gear. The whole point is to make people choose a build and gear to make that build succeed which sometimes forces you into a non optimal situation. The difference between a great player and an average one is a great player in a situation that isn't perfect for them can still win an average one can't. In other words I want people to have to deal with not always being decked out perfectly for a given fight.

[Cyon210]

There will be another tournament likely in early january. I am not going to change the rule on gear. The whole point is to make people choose a build and gear to make that build succeed which sometimes forces you into a non optimal situation. The difference between a great player and an average one is a great player in a situation that isn't perfect for them can still win an average one can't. In other words I want people to have to deal with not always being decked out perfectly for a given fight.

So if I use a pole arm, i have to stick with it the entire fight? no shield switching? mmm

[jedbeetle]

There will be another tournament likely in early january. I am not going to change the rule on gear. The whole point is to make people choose a build and gear to make that build succeed which sometimes forces you into a non optimal situation. The difference between a great player and an average one is a great player in a situation that isn't perfect for them can still win an average one can't. In other words I want people to have to deal with not always being decked out perfectly for a given fight.
SL still 120? I might be able to get my second mage up that high before then....

[Cyon210]

There will be another tournament likely in early january. I am not going to change the rule on gear. The whole point is to make people choose a build and gear to make that build succeed which sometimes forces you into a non optimal situation. The difference between a great player and an average one is a great player in a situation that isn't perfect for them can still win an average one can't. In other words I want people to have to deal with not always being decked out perfectly for a given fight.
SL still 120? I might be able to get my second mage up that high before then....

Of course you can, only takes about a few days of light playing. =)

[tonymontana7724]

I'm confused as to why firestorm is illegal. I am a relatively powerful mage, but I'm sure that if I were restricted to soul arrow/whatnot, there would be no way I could win. Mana is finite while endurance regens pretty quickly meaning that magic characters immediately have a disadvantage in dueling. A good melee character can attack you in the 0.x seconds it takes to cast and block the spell entirely. Just MO, either way I like the idea of honorable combat.. I've been getting summoned by some pretty shady characters lately who have their BP friends hide behind corners and soulsuck me.. nothing quite as low as that.. especially in this game.

[Karkarov]

Well we have gotten to 7 pages now so I guess I can see why you didn't read it all. To cut the crap and get to the point why no firestorm take 759:

Too easy to cast by hiding behind a pillar in 1-4.

Once cast it covers almost the entire width of the room.

If it hits it can simply be cast again for the almost 100% sure lol easy mode pillar haxor win.

Nuff said.

[tonymontana7724]

Fair enough (sorry for the redundancy I should've assumed this had been addressed before), I did watch the videos of the tournament from a little while ago and the mage didn't seem to be at a disadvantage, so you're right. I suppose the only other qualm i have is that the melee characters have a regenerating bank for their attacks while a mage would have to use a spice. Any thoughts on this?

[GuyIncognito]

I suppose the only other qualm i have is that the melee characters have a regenerating bank for their attacks while a mage would have to use a spice. Any thoughts on this?

If you want to allow everything (other than leaving the arena), then anti-magic should also be allowed.

[Karkarov]

Fair enough (sorry for the redundancy I should've assumed this had been addressed before), I did watch the videos of the tournament from a little while ago and the mage didn't seem to be at a disadvantage, so you're right. I suppose the only other qualm i have is that the melee characters have a regenerating bank for their attacks while a mage would have to use a spice. Any thoughts on this?

Not really. They have to worry about mana and regening it sure but there is a payoff. A melee character needs to get to melee to attack. A mage can attack from range and with a number of different moves. Fighting a mage who is skilled is actually a very tough match up when you can't swap shields on the fly and don't have anti magic. Basically the pressure is on the mage to cast so that it counts and his mp isn't wasted. The fact that Frartel did as well as he did without the use of firestorm and still having to regen his mana goes to show a skilled player can make it work.

[CUR715]

So do you guys use 1-4, and not the traditional 4-1?

[Karkarov]

You could watch the vids and see ;p!

*shameless vid plug over*

Yes the first one was in 1-4. I am really begining to doubt 4-1 is usable because every time I go there within 30 seconds I get invaded at almost any time of the day. Makes it hard to hold an organized fight when random invaders keep trying to kill you. Hell 1-4 was had enough I had to fight like 4 invaders at one point between one of the fights. I am looking at changing the venue for the next one though.

[Kenshinx]

Sword of Moonlight going to be useable in next one or no, and can you enter more than one character. I just don't know how my faith build would do without Wrath and Moonlight but would still like to play without but if I can't use Moonlight would like to make another build to.

[CUR715]

You could watch the vids and see ;p!
*shameless vid plug over*


Link please! :D

[Karkarov]

No large sword of moonlight and blind are out and bear in mind I love both weapons personally especially the LSoM. However they completely mitigate shields and I don't want to make it possible to completely null a style of play. The idea is to figure out how to counter that playstyle through skill not a gimick.

Edit: Well some things I may bend on later or take a vote or something. I am not exactly banning alot of stuff here and have already stated wrath and firestorm might be legal in the next one.

More than one character won't be allowed. I mean what do I do if you end up having to fight yourself? It just sort of defeats the point of the contest.

[Karkarov]

You could watch the vids and see ;p!
*shameless vid plug over*


Link please! :D

Geesh you lazy bum! Here is the link to my youtube profile, it has all the vids right there for your perusal. (Edit: Play them from bottom to top, that is the correct chronological order for it.)

http://www.youtube.com/user/ElderMasana

I hope you like trance music ;p!

[CUR715]

See that's why you should use 4-1 - those columns on 1-4 are a pain in the arse!

Anyway, it's your thing, so i'll shut up now. Haha!

Count me in for the next one anyway. ;)

[Karkarov]

See that's why you should use 4-1 - those columns on 1-4 are a pain in the arse!

Anyway, it's your thing, so i'll shut up now. Haha!

Count me in for the next one anyway. ;)

Yeah like I said I am looking at moving it for the next one. I really like 4-1 seriously but the invasions there are so constant it is more than bordering on annoying.

[CUR715]

Maybe have two Blue Phantoms - one who's taking part (versus a summoned BP), and the other one on 'bouncer' duty stood behind the Archstone.

"If ya names not down, ya not coming in!" :lol:

[Legna]

Considering how easily level 712 can be reached quite easily by using a certain method shouldn't it be considered as a possible level for a tournament ?

[SamirDuran]

^^^^ punctuation....why not try 1-1...from the fountain to that huge gate....

[Karkarov]

Considering how easily level 712 can be reached quite easily by using a certain method shouldn't it be considered as a possible level for a tournament ?

A few reasons, first off I hate exploit abusers quite alot. When I say quite alot I mean like I think they all should be punched in the face and hit by cars because they are pathetic losers if they need to cheat at a video game.

Secondly the whole point is a mix of builds and abilities that force choices on the player so they stick to a specific style of play designed around their characters strengths and weaknesses. At level 712 there are no builds everyone has 99 everything so by definition there is no need to design a character around your weaknesses because you don't have any.

Lastly I don't have a character capable of interacting with level 712 players and I don't care to make one either.

[dmyronis]

Karkarov is correct...firestorm and wrat must be illegal for the tournament...an average mage can cast 3 sequential times firestorm which is close to 99% death for the other player.....I have experienced this by players that invade me and is quite lame....

P.S Congrats for the tournament, i show the videos and were amazing....The mage was amazing....

[Karkarov]

*bump* Check the first page for time and location updates.

[Slazer]

YESZ!!!! There will be a much bigger turnout this time fo sho. Is the maximum still 16 players? And if it is what do i have to do to guarantee a spot?

[Sirpwnalot]

Hey count me in man! Ill add you, Karkarov, and send you the gear list once i get my alt to 120. He is 80 now so i can get to 120 in time. But ill play for sure!

Oh i got a question too. I was wondering if you would let NR users who r Pure Black be summoned as black phantoms all the time becos if they were to be summond as a blue phantom and win then they would experience a significant reduction in their attack power. Since their tendency will shift towards white.

By the way tht 1-1 area in the beginning is similar to the 3-1 ballista place, excepts its much shorter which is ofc better for tournament purposes. It also takes time to get to that place whereas the 1-1 area is easy to get to and should be convenient for summoning purposes.

[Karkarov]

Hey count me in man! Ill add you, Karkarov, and send you the gear list once i get my alt to 120. He is 80 now so i can get to 120 in time. But ill play for sure!

Oh i got a question too. I was wondering if you would let NR users who r Pure Black be summoned as black phantoms all the time becos if they were to be summond as a blue phantom and win then they would experience a significant reduction in their attack power. Since their tendency will shift towards white.

By the way tht 1-1 area in the beginning is similar to the 3-1 ballista place, excepts its much shorter which is ofc better for tournament purposes. It also takes time to get to that place whereas the 1-1 area is easy to get to and should be convenient for summoning purposes.

I can't guarantee that you will always be the black phantom it really depends on alot of things and sooner or later two who are black CT are going to have to fight each other and one of them is going to have to be the blue. There is really nothing I can do about that.

1-1 also requires I have a character who hasn't beaten the level but can also summon level 120 participants. Right now I don't meet that criteria on any of my characters but I do plan to do fights there sooner or later.

Edit: I haven't set a max yet. 16 is what I consider "ideal". Like I said I am willing to go as high as 32 but beyond that is a definite no. If it looks like there will be large interest I will do sign up's in advance and hopefully have a actual fight card set up for most of it. Slazer you Frartel and Joest01 will get in if you show for no other reason that the event never would have happened without you guys assisting me in the first place.

[psn_brian]

Is graverobber ring legal? Seems like that shouldn't be allowed since only one of the players can use it. Same with the hidden soul miracle I guess.

[joest01]

I don't really see the use for those in the tournament but I think all rings should be allowed. If someone wants to use foes or friends even ... why not.

[Karkarov]

Is graverobber ring legal? Seems like that shouldn't be allowed since only one of the players can use it. Same with the hidden soul miracle I guess.

Well the whole point is to mix it up and fight and you start fighting basically within plain sight of each other so stealth spells and rings sort of defeat the purpose.

[psn_brian]

That's not true; In the extreme case with thief ring + graverobber, + cloak, you cant lock onto your opponent (or see them) until they're right next to you, which makes it pretty easy for them to run past you for a backstab before you can do anything. Its kind of an interesting strategy, except its much stronger when you're the blue phantom than the black due to graverobber's.

[Monolith]

That's not true; In the extreme case with thief ring + graverobber, + cloak, you cant lock onto your opponent (or see them) until they're right next to you, which makes it pretty easy for them to run past you for a backstab before you can do anything. Its kind of an interesting strategy, except its much stronger when you're the blue phantom than the black due to graverobber's.

To get that effect, you'd have to wear two rings -- souls can only wear one.


I, for one, would be quite interested in how "stealth" would play into PvP. Not sure if it's viable, but it would most certainly be interesting, to say the least.

[dok_dx]

That's not true; In the extreme case with thief ring + graverobber, + cloak, you cant lock onto your opponent (or see them) until they're right next to you, which makes it pretty easy for them to run past you for a backstab before you can do anything. Its kind of an interesting strategy, except its much stronger when you're the blue phantom than the black due to graverobber's.

To get that effect, you'd have to wear two rings -- souls can only wear one.


I, for one, would be quite interested in how "stealth" would play into PvP. Not sure if it's viable, but it would most certainly be interesting, to say the least.

Soul form can wear 2 rings. All you have to do is take off the cling ring.

[Karkarov]

It also sounds like it would make for a crappy vid since I won't be able to see you. It would probably be better if you didn't try it and instead won by the traditional means.

[Sirpwnalot]

Most people have some glowing buff on em so u can clearly c em but u cant target em, so cloaked ppl wont hinder the video.

[Karkarov]

Yeah they will, a glowing buff moving around doesn't look all that entertaining and the whole point of the tournament is to mix it up and win in combat not use a stealth combo to the point your enemy cant even see you. All that turns into is they cast warding or second chance and stand in a corner with their shield up until you make a move. It is flat boring and anti productive and I strongly suggest that you don't do it. In fact since stating I don't want you to do it doesn't seem to be good enough I am now going to update the rules to flat ban all stealth abilities.

[Sirpwnalot]

A glowing buff stabbing someone in the back would look AWESOME!!!!

[ijed]

excellent work with the tourney - just finished my platinum on 160 but might roll a new char or get mine down a bit for this.

Any plans for doing one on the Asian server? Have a few mates with only the Asian version that would be dead keen :)

[Karkarov]

excellent work with the tourney - just finished my platinum on 160 but might roll a new char or get mine down a bit for this.

Any plans for doing one on the Asian server? Have a few mates with only the Asian version that would be dead keen :)

Would if I could but I sadly do not own the asian version :/

[mirazel]

So when is the next tournament?

[Karkarov]

So when is the next tournament?

Check the first post. I updated it with the time and location info for the next tournament.

[NugeorgE]

Hi Karkarov, is it too late to put myself down for the next tourney?

[mirazel]

So when is the next tournament?

Check the first post. I updated it with the time and location info for the next tournament.

Oh excuse me, I didn't realize that it was information for the first tournament. I'll certainly try to get my pvp build to level 120 before then! (although i was hoping to keep him around 80)

[CUR715]

Finally got round to finishing off my PvP SL120 build.

Still not 100% sure on the weapons & equipment i'll be using. But there's a while yet, til the tourney kicks off.

[Karkarov]

Hi Karkarov, is it too late to put myself down for the next tourney?

Nope pm me here or on the psn network. Remember you have to friend me on psn to enter regardless.

[Gr1efa]

Great idea. Looks like it went well and Im looking forward to entering the next one.

[Sirpwnalot]

oh dear my alt is SL123 will you be able to summon that figure?

[Karkarov]

oh dear my alt is SL123 will you be able to summon that figure?

If you de level 3 times sure ;p

[Horn and Zeal]

This sounds great.

[Sirpwnalot]

but oh man 123 is such an awesome number!

[mirazel]

Say i get to around level 110, would i still be able to participate.

[Karkarov]

Say i get to around level 110, would i still be able to participate.

Technically but why participate at a handicap?

[AlexGrave]

I just bought the last copy of the game in my area. I'm hoping to get my character up to 120 in time for this as unlikely to happen as that sounds T_T

[mirazel]

Say i get to around level 110, would i still be able to participate.

Technically but why participate at a handicap?

Just feeling a little lazy so i might not level to 120.

[Decaying Corpse]

when is the deadline for signing up? sorry if it is on the first page.. did not see. I currently am leveling a guy who should be ready.

[dwighteb]

First, I wanted to thank Karkarov and everybody else who have invested their time and efforts in making this PVP Tourney BETA a reality. I think it's awesome that folks are willing to come together to make these sorts of community driven things happen.

Apologies in advance if this was already answered elsewhere in the thread (I read it all, but didn't quite get it explicitly addressed), I do have a question regarding the bans that are placed on different abilities and weapons. I'm not questioning the individual bans in isolation or even collectively, as for all I know, every one of them are very well reasoned, well researched, and contribute as a whole to making a more enjoyable PVP experience, both for the participants and for the spectators.

I am curious as to what method best describes the instantiation of the bans.

1.) "We (Karkarov and associates) have conducted PVP tournaments in the past and have witnessed the aforementioned actions/weapons were abusive or overpowered, and the community at large were unable to come up with ways to shut down those actions/weapons, even after multiple tournaments, hence we have disallowed them to create a more varied and enjoyable experience for all."

2.) "We (Karkarov and associates) have conducted tests in the past and have witnessed the aforementioned actions/weapons were abusive or overpowered, and we (Karkarov and associates) were unable to come up with ways to shut down those actions/weapons, even after multiple test cycles, hence we have disallowed them to create a more varied and enjoyable experience for all. We believe that our tests are thorough enough, and that the PVP community at large would also be unable to come up with ways to shut down the aforementioned actions/weapons."

3.) "There have been PVP tournaments conducted in other regions, and they have instantiated the aforementioned ban, hence we have also instantiated said ban. We are unsure as to the methods that were used by those tournament officials in instantiating those bans."

4.) "There have been PVP tournaments conducted in other regions, and they have instantiated the aforementioned ban, hence we have also instantiated said ban. We do know that in those tournaments, they had originally allowed these aforementioned weapons/abilities initially, but they and the community had found those things overpowered and/or abusive, and in those tournaments the community was unable to come up with ways to shut them down."

5.) "There have been PVP tournaments conducted in other regions, and they have instantiated the aforementioned ban, hence we have also instantiated said ban. We do know that in those tournaments, the tournament officials had decided on these bans due to their own testing instead of witnessing how the PVP community responded to the aforementioned abilities/weapons."

There probably are other methods that went in to initially instantiating these bans, thus feel free to add your own. In any event, since there are multiple weapon/ability bans, there could be different methods that went in to those different situations (for instance, perhaps method 4 for acid cloud/scraping spear, and method 2 for firestorm, as an example). However, I'd imagine that one method, would probably crop up as to the most often utilized method in implementing a ban. Thus, my question to the tournament directors, if I may be so bold - what method best describes how you went about implementing most of your bans?

Again, I want to reiterate that I am not calling in to question any individual ban or even all of them collectively - from my viewpoint, they probably all are very legitimate. I'd just like to know the actual method to initially instantiate said bans.

Thanks in advance, and good luck to all participants in future tournaments!
Dwight

[Karkarov]

.... I have already explained why the handful of illegal abilities and items are banned. Do I really need to go down the line and give a 20 minutes explanation on each one even though on firestorm alone I have already done it something like 4 times? If you don't like the rules don't participate. I am not forcing anyone to join and I don't "owe" anyone some drawn out explanation. My tournament, my rules, the end. You want a tournament with a different set up I invite to host your own. You will be pleasantly surprised when I do not come into your thread and tell you how you are doing it wrong.

Here is the ultra brief explanation about how I decided what would be illegal though. I played the game for over 200 hours, learned a couple things while I did so, decided to run a pvp tournament, asked a bunch of other players who had also played a long time what they thought, came to a concensus about what shouldn't be allowed, the end. In the case of the stealth thing that was because a few forum users didn't seem to get the idea that a fighting tournament is about actual fighting not hiding and getting a one shot kill because your enemy can't see you.

There is no deadline to sign up, but you have to do so by contacting me on psn.

[Karkarov]

PS: The tournament once again will be on 1/12/10 at 8pm EST which is in roughly 4 days. Now would be the time to contact me on PSN if you are interested. For the record firestorm and wrath are still illegal for the moment unless I can get some more hands on testing in the actual area itself before then.

[O.M.A.C]

i still think they should not be allowed but thats just my opinion... also is there a way we can move it to the top of the stairs in 3.1 instead of the bottom just a suggestion