Xenosaga I&II

[B.K.]

I thought there was already a thread for this game, but apparently not. Since Atlus managed to get Bandai Namco to let go of Endless Frontier, I'd like to see them try to get Xenosaga I&II from them too.

[Pibbman]

I thought there was already a thread for this game, but apparently not. Since Atlus managed to get Bandai Namco to let go of Endless Frontier, I'd like to see them try to get Xenosaga I&II from them too.

I don't know where you live....but Xenosaga I, II and III are already released in the US.

[Kakizaki]

^I believe he is referring to the DS game.

[Pibbman]

^I believe he is referring to the DS game.

He should be more clear then.

[xHaseox]

Just when I had forgotten about this title...you monster!

*bursts into tears*

As a HUGE Xenosaga fanboy, I support this fully, though I doubt it will ever happen.

[Haruhi_claw]

I approve of this too. Summon Night Twin Age was also a Bandai Namco game.

Atlus has a knack for convincing the unlikeliest of companies to let them publish games. Even Nintendo themselves, with Polarium Advance.

[System_Error]

I'd play it.

[Pibbman]

I approve of this too. Summon Night Twin Age was also a Bandai Namco game.

Atlus has a knack for convincing the unlikeliest of companies to let them publish games. Even Nintendo themselves, with Polarium Advance.

It's probably because Atlus Japan is putting their reputation on the line for Atlus USA, which is allowing these things to happen.

[kat_ears_kahrain]

I approve of this too. Summon Night Twin Age was also a Bandai Namco game.

Atlus has a knack for convincing the unlikeliest of companies to let them publish games. Even Nintendo themselves, with Polarium Advance.

It's probably because Atlus Japan is putting their reputation on the line for Atlus USA, which is allowing these things to happen.

Which must be paying off well enough to continue translating some of these titles.

I'm in support of Xenosaga I&II for the DS. I imported it when it was released and kept expecting to see it translated. Once Nintendo acquired Monolith Soft, my hopes had dropped, since Nintendo of America are pansies when it comes to anything remotely controversial. But now that I see something like Mugen no Frontier brought over, my hopes are once again raised...

[hanseo]

i hope you know namco owns the xenosaga ip

[Sanctine]

He should be more clear then.

Uhh. No, that was pretty clear. Anyone would have realized the first two games are already out here.

Anyway, it's not going to happen, but I'm a huge Xenosaga fan, so I'm throwing my support in for this one. It was one of the main reasons I bought a DS, so you can imagine how disappointing it was for it never to make its way over here.

[Kakizaki]

^Imagine how disappointed I was asking for a PSP for Xmas of '05 in anticipation of Devil Summoner PSP. ;)

Anyway, I can't see this happening, but I would definitely be interested if it did.

[Boss_Tuff]

I'm adding support for this as well, but I also feel that it's highly unlikely to happen. Sad too because I'm sure it would turn out great.

[jeffx]

Will never happen, but I would day-price-drop it.

[dragonlife29]

I want this, too, since I love Xenosaga =(

[slayn]

Wouldn't this game have been better on the PSP? It has a better screen for watching movies after all.

[B.K.]

He should be more clear then.

How was I not clear? The title of the DS game is Xenosaga I&II.

[Kakizaki]

^Knock it off. Drop it guys.

[Green Card]

I would definitely get this. I only played the first Xenosaga but I really liked it.

[RayFoxSith]

It sucks even more due to the fact that the series fared much more better over here than in Japan, yet we didn't see any of the expansions nor the spin-off titles. Namco Bandai is truly a strange company.

[Enzeru]

How is Xenosaga, BTW? I wanna try Episode I out, but I'm not sure what it's like. I read on Wikipedia that it was heavily (and noticeably) edited...

[Saishu]

The game is very long and drawn out. But you may eventually get to liking the characters.

I'm surprised I was even able to play through the first game twice. I had so much patience back then.

[Enzeru]

Well, I have a lot of time on my hands, so I'll probably get it tomorrow when I reserve Devil Survivor. It's only 6 dollars used, so I see it hard to regret the purchase...

[Kenji]

@ Enzeru:

There's a good game under Xenosaga's hood, though it's never utilized to its full potential. If you explore Episode I's play mechanics, you have a system with interesting customization potential (in my most recent playthrough, I was keeping MOMO underleveled so I could boost her Ether Attack stat as high as possible) but the game never really requires you to use it.

This series is also infamous for the incredibly long cutscenes. The first episode was to the point where you could string all of the cutscenes together and have a functional movie. Episode II and III, not so much.

In many ways, Xenosaga takes on a lot of the themes MegaTen goes after, but it's much more pretentious about it.

Episode II suffers from overlong standard battles, a horrible field soundtrack, and an attempt at story simplification that basically killed the series. Xenosaga I·II is an attempt to fix Episode II for the most part and, technically, Episode III is the sequel to the DS game rather than the PS2 one (though the plots are almost identical, the execution's just better and there's more backstory). Episode III was a nice return to form, but it was too late to save the series. So we ended up with an understandably rushed ending where carefully constructed antagonists pretty much throw themselves into your line of fire because the clock's almost out.

I think I can confidently say that, had it not been for Episode II, we might be wondering which next-gen system Episode IV would be on.

Anyway, it's worth a shot, and there's a ton more I can say about it, but I think I'll conclude that it was the biggest disappointment of my game-playing life. Don't get me wrong, it's worth your time if you can put up with all the things wrong with it, but it could've been much better than it was.

Anyway, I'd love to see Xenosaga I·II over here, since I also wanted to play it (though I did get the Japanese version for $15, thanks to a Play-Asia weekly special a couple of years ago). However, if you look around, you'll notice that the Xeno fandom has died. I've been a member of Xenogears God and Mind (forums.xgam.org) for upwards to eight or nine years, and even though there was a nice community and we kept talking for quite awhile after the series ended... well... the forum's dead, like so many others.

Actually, I was discussing with another forumgoer about how the site should've evolved to include MegaTen, since it's a natural leap to go from one to the other.

Anyway, long story short, though I'd love to see it come here, I'm quite convinced Atlus wouldn't be able to break even.

[Elio]

I think there's already a fantranslation project for this. But I don't think that this is a good game for Atlus to bring over from Japan...

[Onyx_a87]

As a Xenosaga fan I have it, but its really nothing special. Very GBA like in graphical quality and its menu system is a bit convoluted. The gameplay though is a neat take on the earlier Xenosaga games (well 1 and 2 actually, guess that would make sense) but some things are a bit off, like what would normally be a save station in the console versions and the random battles.

[VMan]

@ Enzeru:

I think I can confidently say that, had it not been for Episode II, we might be wondering which next-gen system Episode IV would be on.



If I understood correctly, the internal issues with the Xenosaga series came about during the development of Episode II. At least part of it were strong disagreements in creative differences, and some key people left on bitter terms.

Xenosaga was indeed supposed to span far longer than it did (I believe at least 6 episodes inevitably spanning multiple console generations), but that plan broke down because of what went on behind of this scenes of Episode II, not BECAUSE of Episode II.

Still, Episode III, though indeed the product of a rushed conclusion requiring humongous chunks of story cut out, is IMO a very fine game for what it is. I found it easily the most well-done of the series and personally consider it a classic.

[Kain Mare]

Love the Xenosaga series. My personal opinion, I recommend the game. The story alone is worth the play through. I grew to love the characters and cried when a few of them died. Shame the series was cut half way through. ::sigh::

But, I believe Namco.jp owns the rights to it. If it *does* come over to the states, it will more than likely come over with Namco-Bandai.

[Kenji]

If I understood correctly, the internal issues with the Xenosaga series came about during the development of Episode II. At least part of it were strong disagreements in creative differences, and some key people left on bitter terms.
Pretty much.

As far as I can tell, it was the fallout of Tetsuya Takahashi repeatedly exceeding deadlines and budgets. So, not only was Episode I half its originally intended length (look at Episode II's relative snip of a plot and the old eight-minute trailer for Episode I that featured Jin's duel with Margulis among other Episode II scenes), but it was far more expensive than it planned out. So, MonolithSoft booted Takahashi from the director's chair.

The new director, Kou Arai, went for a different approach, one that was characterized by the phrase "easier to read" and "more explosions" (so Saga said). The result of this was the removal of Soraya Saga (the main writer and Takahashi's wife) from the project and the overhaul of her already-finished plot, the fascinating details of which she later released on her website "Fridge." The result was a plot and execution that were sorely lacking when compared to Episode I.

The situation wasn't helped by the schizophrenic appointment of Yuki Kajiura and Shinji Hosoe for the soundtrack, which made me alternate between awe and wanting to dig my eardrums out with spoons depending on whether it was a cinema or field sequence, respectively.

Xenosaga I·II, I believe, was directed by Takahashi (don't quote me on that!), while Pied Piper was written by Saga. Episode III brought Takahashi back as a creative consultant and Kajiura was made sole musician. The product drastically improved as a result.

Xenosaga was indeed supposed to span far longer than it did (I believe at least 6 episodes inevitably spanning multiple console generations), but that plan broke down because of what went on behind of this scenes of Episode II, not BECAUSE of Episode II
Six episodes was the original plan. However, since Episode I seems to only have covered half or two-thirds of what it was supposed to cover, who knows how long the series would've gone had it been popular.

The ending of the series at Episode III, however, was a financial decision rather than a creative one. I wish I could call up sources on this, but there was some heavy indication that many events that were being reserved for Episode IV were shoved into III (i.e. all events after Abel's Ark). I also recall Takahashi stating that he had a plan to divide the series into two arcs separated so far in time that only the immortal characters would still be around. Fan speculation was that this would be an AU of Xenogears, but we'll never know now.

Also note that there were two Xenosaga projects that were cancelled (Xenosaga Exceed and Xenosaga Frontier) presumably due to poor sales of Episode III. Though a steadily shrinking audience was inevitable due to the serial nature of the series, Episode II exacerbated the situation by turning off a lot of its fanbase, including a large percentage of those who got into the series thanks to Xenogears.

And, yeah, I like Episode III, too. :P Got huge amounts of nostalgia when I was showing it to a friend of mine.


EDIT: I found those details that Saga posted.

o Ziggy's past history (as seen in The Pied Piper)

o U.R.T.V.'s past history (as seen in the Episode II)

o Shion's past history with Febronia (removed)

o Jr's rapid growing (removed)

o Both juvenile and grown-up Jr. available in the battle (removed)

o The ghost of the old Miltia (removed)

o The death of Sakura (removed)

o Brief reunion with grown-up Citrine (removed)

o Gaignun vs Zohar emulators (removed)

o Jr.'s transformation/overdrive (removed)

o Jr. & Albedo vs U-DO vs KOS-MOS 3rd armament (removed)

o Shion's spiritual seeking/witnessing/awakening (removed)

o The truth about KOS-MOS (removed)

o Conversation between chaos and the red cloak man (removed)

o Conversation between Nephilim and the boy with the blocks (removed)

o An antimatter annihilation of Albedo (removed)

Some of these were reinserted in Xenosaga I·II, others were inserted into Episode III (which featured yet more Miltian going-ons, probably because Episode II didn't properly cover it despite being mostly devoted to it), while others were simply lost. If you think about it, none of the three episodes really went as planned and any mistakes in one ended up forcing its sequels to compensate or regain lost ground at the expense of them doing their own stories.

In other words, it's entirely possible that I and II were the originally planned Episode I, Missing Year and Episode III featured the substance of the original Episode II, and the Michtam wrap-up had a heavily compressed version of the original Episode III (which was to be Episode IV, I'm willing to bet), leaving Episode IV to start the new arc.

[RayFoxSith]

It should be noted that the creators have mentioned going and continuing the series if there was a popular demand for it. Also, it could lead to a potential remake of Xenogears, but then again I have no idea how the copyright works in this situation.

[Gunloc]

I would buy this.

[Mathurin47]

It should be noted that the creators have mentioned going and continuing the series if there was a popular demand for it. Also, it could lead to a potential remake of Xenogears, but then again I have no idea how the copyright works in this situation.

I'd love to see the story told in its entirety. But who would fund a 3rd attempt?

[Pibbman]

He should be more clear then.

How was I not clear? The title of the DS game is Xenosaga I&II.

Because I was not aware there was a Xenosaga I&II, I don't own a DS thus I'm not current on DS news. I assumed you were talking about Xenosaga episode I and Episode II on PS2.

[sagamaru_93]

i only played episode 3 having this in my ds would be MARVELOUS(i cant read japanese)

[AbsyntheDelacroix]

I've played through all the three Xenosaga chapters for the PS2 and boy do I feel sad for them. And I'm ashamed to admit that I never got around to finishing the second one. But the first and the third were perfect in my opinion. Especially the third. And am I the only one that loved the twenty-minute long cutscenes? I'd day one this.

[Zacewing]

I'd play it.

This. I'm a huge Xenosaga fan.

'Tis a shame that the PS2 titles flopped, though.

[kat_ears_kahrain]

I'd play it.

This. I'm a huge Xenosaga fan.

'Tis a shame that the PS2 titles flopped, though.

Yeah, I'm upset at that too. I was hoping for a total resolution to the XenoXXXX story, especially after reading the Xenogears Perfect Works, which only hints at Episode Six.

It was rather clear to me after playing Episode II that something had been lost during the development.

Hearing that some of the finer plot points that were omitted or glossed over are there in the DS version makes me want an English version all the more.

[Kenji]

It was rather clear to me after playing Episode II that something had been lost during the development.
Yup, Tetsuya Takahashi and Soraya Saga. :P Though they (i.e. T2) were reportedly horrible for budgets, they truly were the heart and soul of the Xenoverse.

[Zacewing]

Yeah, the DS version of Episode 2 sounds much better, cause it uses Episode 1's battle system and the story is told through Shion's perspective instead of Jr.'s.

Episode 2's battle system was great and all, but taking 10 minutes just to kill some random enemies = Major failure.

[BONN]

I just watched a trailer for the next SRT and saw that KOS-MOS is in it, which naturally got me to thinking of this game, which naturally got me to wondering why I never played it.

Come on Atlus, this great RPG has just been sitting there for like three years and NOBODY IS GOING TO GRAB IT BUT YOU.

[DamageCity]

?!!?

uh...

[Yet Another Tim]

BUMP!

Oh, seeing how Monolith Soft is now a Nintendo in-house developer, I actually took the time and liberty to ask them whether they'd consider localizing it.

Here's the entire e-mail response:

Hello Timothy,



As you may have heard , Xenosaga I & II has been announced in Japan. So far, there hasn't been an official announcement of a release in this market.



While I’m unable to offer a specific reason regarding this title, there are many reasons that Nintendo or any other publisher may decide to release a game in one market, but not another. These can include difficulty or cost of localization, the size and financial strength of the publisher, the size of the distribution network, and (most often) the idea that the game will simply not be accepted or enjoyed in another market.



However, there are (like you) real fans of those games or franchises in this market who would love nothing more than to see these games on store shelves here. I understand (and sometimes even share) your frustration! Having said that, please understand that those fans may constitute too small a portion of the gaming public to justify the costs associated with bringing a game here.



Of course, you never know what the future holds, as evidenced by the appearance in this market of previously Japan-only franchises like Advance Wars and Fire Emblem. Keep an eye on our website (http://www.nintendo.com) for all the latest news as it becomes available.



Sincerely,


T. J. Geise
Nintendo of America Inc.

Oh, going back on topic, here's how I see of this, in terms of the companies that are the likely ones that would even consider localizing this:

1. Atlus USA
2. Nintendo of America
3. Namco Bandai Games America

[VMan]

BUMP!

Oh, seeing how Monolith Soft is now a Nintendo in-house developer, I actually took the time and liberty to ask them whether they'd consider localizing it.

Here's the entire e-mail response:

Hello Timothy,



As you may have heard , Xenosaga I & II has been announced in Japan. So far, there hasn't been an official announcement of a release in this market.



While I’m unable to offer a specific reason regarding this title, there are many reasons that Nintendo or any other publisher may decide to release a game in one market, but not another. These can include difficulty or cost of localization, the size and financial strength of the publisher, the size of the distribution network, and (most often) the idea that the game will simply not be accepted or enjoyed in another market.



However, there are (like you) real fans of those games or franchises in this market who would love nothing more than to see these games on store shelves here. I understand (and sometimes even share) your frustration! Having said that, please understand that those fans may constitute too small a portion of the gaming public to justify the costs associated with bringing a game here.



Of course, you never know what the future holds, as evidenced by the appearance in this market of previously Japan-only franchises like Advance Wars and Fire Emblem. Keep an eye on our website (http://www.nintendo.com) for all the latest news as it becomes available.



Sincerely,


T. J. Geise
Nintendo of America Inc.

Oh, going back on topic, here's how I see of this, in terms of the companies that are the likely ones that would even consider localizing this:

1. Atlus USA
2. Nintendo of America
3. Namco Bandai Games America

NoA would still have to license it out, though, right? If I'm not mistaken, its still a Namco Bandai IP.

[Yet Another Tim]

NoA would still have to license it out, though, right? If I'm not mistaken, its still a Namco Bandai IP.

Wait, you mean, Namco Bandai owns the trademarks, copyrights, and licenses, yet, Nintendo has to spend $$$ in a game, by proxy, they developed (keep in mind that Monolith Soft is now an in-house 1st-party Nintendo developer)? O_O

Wow, this is giving me the impression that it's gonna be a variation of Tales of Phantasia GBA US release.

[VMan]

NoA would still have to license it out, though, right? If I'm not mistaken, its still a Namco Bandai IP.

Wait, you mean, Namco Bandai owns the trademarks, copyrights, and licenses, yet, Nintendo has to spend $$$ in a game, by proxy, they developed (keep in mind that Monolith Soft is now an in-house 1st-party Nintendo developer)? O_O

Wow, this is giving me the impression that it's gonna be a variation of Tales of Phantasia GBA US release.

Its not unheard of. For example, Microsoft didn't acquire every asset Rare created when they bought them. And it is often the case when a developers creates an IP for a publisher, it becomes the property of the publisher and no longer belongs to the dev. And lets not forget that Nintendo does not completely own Monolith Soft. They are the majority stockholder, yes, but Namco Bandai still owns a part of the company as well.

[Yet Another Tim]

...Microsoft didn't acquire every asset Rare created when they bought them. And it is often the case when a developers creates an IP for a publisher, it becomes the property of the publisher and no longer belongs to the dev. And lets not forget that Nintendo does not completely own Monolith Soft. They are the majority stockholder, yes, but Namco Bandai still owns a part of the company as well.

With that small of a share that Namco Bandai owns in Monolith Soft, it actually got away with having Monolith Soft, developing a DBZ game (DBZ: Attack of the Saiyans). >_>

Going back on topic, I'd rather put my faith in either Atlus USA or Nintendo of America, instead of NBGA, since I&II are 2D, and NBGA is 3D ONLY.

[Zacewing]

Plus NBGA normally doesn't localize half their #### anyway.

[Yet Another Tim]

Plus NBGA normally doesn't localize half their #### anyway.

You mean, it would rather ass rape other companies, when it comes to licensing fees?

[Phoenix_Apollo]

Bumped. With the releases of OG Saga and the DBZ RPG, and the announcement of OG Saga EXCEED coming to America, I really think Atlus should at least ask about this. I would love for this to happen, since Xenosaga, while quite a fantastic trilogy, feels incomplete due to the multiple missing plot points the original Episode II omitted. If NOA and NB says no, then that's that. But you don't know unless you try...

[Enzeru]

Bumped. With the releases of OG Saga and the DBZ RPG, and the announcement of OG Saga EXCEED coming to America, I really think Atlus should at least ask about this. I would love for this to happen, since Xenosaga, while quite a fantastic trilogy, feels incomplete due to the multiple missing plot points the original Episode II omitted. If NOA and NB says no, then that's that. But you don't know unless you try...
WHAT?! EXCEED is coming to America? Since when?

[Juanblue85]

Monolith Soft is part of Nintendo now so the game may get a chance if given.

[jj984jj]

Monolith Soft is part of Nintendo now so the game may get a chance if given.

Nintendo won't even localize their own MonolithSoft RPG on the DS, why would they give this a chance?

[illogicaldreamr]

You've all heard about the recent announcement for Xenoblade for the Wii, right?

There's a teaser site up with some really nice music.

http://www.nintendo.co.jp/wii/sx4j/index.html

[Phoenix_Apollo]

I thought EXCEED was confirmed for America? If not then I apologize.

And they better effing release Xenoblade in America. Even if it isn't related to Xenogears or Xenosaga, I'll still buy it.

Perhaps they're testing the waters with this and they'll release Xenoaga I&II here if this does well? I hope so.